Unknown forces eating CPU

Toshiba Satellite c650d-st2n01 notebook
August 17, 2010 at 17:39:46
Specs: Windows XP SP3, AMD 2.2ghz/2gb ram
I'm bought a Toshiba Satellite C650D 2 months ago, and I used the windows 7 that came with it thinking it was all fine and dandy until some days ago, it started getting random lag spikes, at first it just occured when watching movies (tried 4 different programs, reinstalled all driver, scanned for malware, defragged, you name it) then it started happening outside the movie-viewing aswell. That did it for me, and I installed windows XP. I've done so 3 times now, clean installs of windows XP. At first it seemed fine. For some hours, then it started lagging really bad, not like in windows 7, but CPU usage is jumping around in the boundaries between 1% and 99& randomly, but there is no processes taking it! It lags whatever I do, just opening notepad can make it jump. I figured it would work with a clean format, but noo, of course the problem reoccured. It could perhaps be drivers, seing as the problems in 7 and XP are somewhat different. I'm at my wits ends here on what to do, anything would be helpful. As it is now it feels like it might be a hardware issue.

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#1
August 18, 2010 at 06:09:46
If the CPU is overheating your laptop will throttle back the CPU speed to keep the temperatures down.

I suspect your airflow is somewhat restricted. Try blowing out the vents using canned compressed air.

You are probably stressing the laptop.

You need to understand how a notebook/laptop controls the CPU. The CPU can run at variable speeds. The numbers you mention above are percentages of available CPU cycles.

If the CPU has been throttled back to prevent overheating the actual speed is of course less than max. So, if a task that uses 40% of CPU cycles at full CPU speeds is then running while the CPU is throttled back to 50% speed the percentage of CPU cycles used will jump to 80% without actually using more cycles.

notebooks are not really designed to be multimedia devices. Get yourself a desktop computer with a decent size screen if you want a platform to watch movies.

If you went back to WinXP there is a good chance you don't have all the best drivers installed either. There may not even be any available.


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#2
August 18, 2010 at 06:21:12
Thing is that I only use it on a table so they cannot possibly be restricted. And as I said, the new installation works good for some hours before it starts jacking up the CPU usage, even if it has been on for a good 24 hours. The drivers are all from the Toshiba homepage, and they're all compatible as far as installation goes.

Note: Had a HP laptop before this which I used 24/7 in my bed for two solid years, and no problem whatsoever. Seems weird that this one, with which I have not, would get problems with the conditioning for no reason after 2 months usage.


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#3
August 18, 2010 at 06:41:45
More powerful CPU equates to possible overheating. Try downloading speedfan to monitor temps in the tray. That should tell you if it is overheating. Get speedfan at the link below.

http://download.cnet.com/SpeedFan/3...


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Related Solutions

#4
August 18, 2010 at 07:14:44
Okay, this is what I see in the program:

http://img97.imageshack.us/img97/76...


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#5
August 18, 2010 at 08:53:57
Try the program again while watching a movie, or whenever the computer slows down. Idle temperatures don't mean much.

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#6
August 18, 2010 at 09:02:17
Maybe not, but as you can see, the CPU usage is high nonetheless.

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#7
August 18, 2010 at 09:07:06
Check in Task manager> running processes, to see what processes are using the cycles. Post back.

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#8
August 18, 2010 at 09:29:03
None.. that's kinda the problem from the start, that no process visible is using the CPU, which is written in my first post as well. I'll post screenshot from task manager if you want.

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#9
August 18, 2010 at 09:38:22
If nothing showing in task manager is using the cycles then I would guess you may have an infection of some sort. The process is hiding.

System idle process is not the process using 98%?

Do you have the box to check all users ticked?


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#10
August 18, 2010 at 09:41:06
Check the other tabs when in task manager. Look to see what is happening in the network tab, how many users, what programs are running, etc.

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#11
August 18, 2010 at 09:55:30
K, we safely remove the overheating for now, tested game/movie and surfing net and no difference. About task manager:

PF Usage: 0/356

Totals = Handles: around 8070, Threads: 445, processes: 40.

Commit charge = Total: around 364748, Limit: 3769484, Peak: 428728.

Physical Memory = Total 1829712, Available: around 1378700, System cache: around 505904.

Kernel memory= Total: around 52800, Paged: around 30280, nonpaged: around 22504.

The wireless network that I use jumps from about 0.10 to 0.95% in network utilization.

Only user, ID 0, session: console.


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#12
August 18, 2010 at 13:41:35
Ah, about to throw this s--- out of the window

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#13
August 18, 2010 at 14:17:05
Are you using Process Explorer? If not it is a good freebie which gives you a lot more info than task manager:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/...

On mine if you just boot up and wait a while, about all you see is System Idle Process, which is 100% or close to. There is brief activity from other places but that's all. I have pruned startup apps rather which will obvious make some difference.


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#14
August 18, 2010 at 16:27:03
Yeah, tried that infact some time ago, something ate it alright i remember, Ill check again.

Edit: The feature eating CPU is something called "Hardware interrupts". This is strange indeed, I have no idea to be honest what hardware that is acting weird. Can my processor itself just have gone bad, just like that?


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#15
August 18, 2010 at 17:42:56
Hardware Interrupts (IRQ) are how Windows keeps order with your hardware. If there are no problems showing in Device Manager then that isn't the issue.

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#16
August 18, 2010 at 18:28:53
Solved it finally, phew, what was the problem was the Toshiba 400mb-whatever-it-is IDE driver. It was locked on Pio-mode. I uninstalled the driver, restarted the computer and it works now, yay.

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#17
August 19, 2010 at 12:13:34
The primary IDE channel of my Toshiba was running on Pio-mode making the computer unusable. Uninstalling and reinstalling seemed to work, as it started using DMA-mode, for a couple of hours. Now it started lagging again, and it started using Pio-mode again.
Tried reinstall/uninstall and its good for a while until it decides to go back into Pio again.

What can I do to keep it in DMA-mode, and what is causing the Pio enforcement?


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#18
August 19, 2010 at 18:27:28
WinXP will automatically drop back to PIO is it senses a problem with DMA.

Look at all the IRQ assignments. Nothing else should be using the two IRQs assigned to the IDE channels.


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#19
August 20, 2010 at 07:32:13
Okay, where should I check this? Checking IRQ-numbers in device manager now, and I can't see the IDE channel there except "Standard dual channel PCI IDE Controller" (which is probably it), and it uses the number 19, nothing else is though.

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#20
August 20, 2010 at 08:49:37
I'm just wondering if your glitch comes about when the system can't cope and switches itself from DMA to PIO. Some machines don't like DMA I'm afraid.

I wonder what would happen if, when the machine is running OK on DMA, "you" switch it to PIO. If the machine then behaves it might just be a case of not using DMA.

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#21
August 20, 2010 at 10:00:26
Tried going Pio mode only and lag commenced instantly. :(

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#22
August 20, 2010 at 10:51:32
Is anything else using IRQ 19 then?

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#23
August 20, 2010 at 14:54:26
Nope, 2 on 18, but that's it.

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#24
August 20, 2010 at 15:12:57
Google around for:
"hd reverts from dma to pio"
There are quite a few hits, although many are about CD\DVD.

Is there anything showing in Events when this happens?


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#25
August 21, 2010 at 09:25:41
Yeah, I've googled for that but there's no slution afaik.

Checking event viewer I find several errors and warning under the system-tab:

1. error, source: atapi, eventID 9 (this ought to be a problem-maker, says something about IdePort0 did not respon within the timeout period)
2. warning, source: tcpip, eventID 4226
3. warning, source::dhcp, eventID 1003 (this one occurs several times on the list on different times)
4. error, source:DCOM, eventID 10016 (this one occurs several times on the list on different times)

these 4 occured during the last DMA to Pio-change.

Edit: Found out that atapi = DVD


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#26
August 21, 2010 at 12:40:20
There are three Toshiba Satellite C650D laptops.

650D-BT2N11
650D-ST2N01
650D-ST2NX1

Which do you have?


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#27
August 21, 2010 at 14:13:11
I believe there are more than just three, cause mine is named C650D 113. Unable to find any other description of it, cause that what it says on the computer and the box.

If the rule that 6 timeouts causes it to revert to Pio, shouldn't it report this 6 times in the event viewer then? Cause I can't really find anything of use.


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#28
August 21, 2010 at 15:10:14
The Toshibe site only lists 3 models of 650D. More without the D.

Download SIW and check what processor and motherboard chip set your laptop uses. The Toshiba site does give the chip set information. May help with your problem. Get SIW at the link below.

http://www.gtopala.com/siw-download...


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#29
August 21, 2010 at 15:54:29
From what I can make of it the events given are not the reason for your current issues. Some might be a result of what happened rather than the cause.

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#30
August 21, 2010 at 18:10:04
@Othehill:

Processor: AMD V120.
Moterboard model: TOSHIBA Portable PC
Chipset: AMD M785 (RS880M) + Hudson-1

Bios manufacturer: Insyde software
Bios version 1.40

Checked this up earlier with HWiNFO, and couldn't find much information myself on the chipset, it doesnt seem to exist on the AMD site, not to be found atleast.


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#31
August 21, 2010 at 19:14:08
That is the north bridge. I would guess it is paired with the ATI SB710. If that is the case, there is no AMD drivers to speak of for WinXP.

The link below describes that chip set.

http://www.amd.com/us/products/desk...

You have the C650D-BT2N11

I suggest you revert back to Windows 7x64 and then install the HDD patch from the Toshiba site. Link below. The HDD patch is not available for WinXP.

http://www.csd.toshiba.com/cgi-bin/...

From the link above refine your search using the drop down menus. Choose HDD and you will see it is only available for Windows 7. Has a June 2010 date.


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#32
August 21, 2010 at 20:07:01
If your hard is failing, that could be what is causing Windows to force the drive into PIO mode. .

Seagate's Seatools will test any brand of hard drive.
Download the bootable CD version and make the CD.
Do the long test.
http://www.seagate.com/ww/v/index.j...
.......

" .....I installed windows XP. I've done so 3 times now, clean installs of windows XP."

Did you load the main chipset drivers?

XP doesn't have the drivers built in for most things that first came out after XP was first released, circa 2001, and it doesn't have some of the drivers built in for things made before that.

Whenever you load Windows from a regular Windows CD (or DVD) from scratch, after Setup is finished you must load the drivers for the mboard, particularly the main chipset drivers, in order for Windows to have the proper drivers for and information about your mboard hardware, including it's AGP or PCI-E, ACPI, USB 2.0 if it has it, and hard drive controller support. If you have a generic system and have the CD that came with the mboard, all the necessary drivers are on it. If you load drivers from the web, brand name system builders and mboard makers often DO NOT have the main chipset drivers listed in the downloads for your model - in that case you must go to the maker of the main chipset's web site, get the drivers, and load them.


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#33
August 22, 2010 at 05:21:45
@OtheHill:

Is the alleged HDD-patch in fact a patch? it goes under Hdd/utility named Toshiba HDD/SSD Alert(v3.1.64.6; 02-18-2010; 37.13M), seems more like some sort of alarm tool than an actual driver update.

@Tubesandwires:

Didn't actually get any cd's or anything with the package, just the computer and 2 books or something, not containing any cd's.


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#34
August 22, 2010 at 06:07:54
skrewster

I am not sure but I found a couple of versions of it.

At any rate I couldn't find any drivers at the AMD site for a 785G/SB710 combination. Closest is for 780G/SB710.

That tells me that AMD left the drivers up to the manufacturer. Could be the manufacturer of the motherboard or could be Toshiba.

At any rate, you still have the same issues with both OSes. Why run one that has no driver support. As tubesandwires pointed out above WinXP wouldn't have integrated drivers for hardware not yet in the pipeline when the OS or SPs were written. So WinXP is providing the best driver it has available.

Look at the driver date under the controller listing in Device Manager to see when it was written. Be under advanced.

If you had gotten any disks they would be for Windows 7 x64, not WinXP 32.


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#35
August 22, 2010 at 07:32:13
Much as I like XP I would add my support to the idea of re-installing Windows 7, as the machine is only 2 months old.

You might still have a problem to solve but the danger with using XP on it is that you are likely to add drivers issues to the situation, making problem solving even more confusing.

Even if Windows 7 doesn't automatically supply the correct drivers you will get far more support, patches and so forth from your computer manufacturer if it is running the intended OS.

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#36
August 22, 2010 at 08:58:09
Yeah, thought of the idea before, brought home a copy of windows 7 ultimate x86, gonna try if there's any differance from the x64, probably not. This version is more updated however than the other windows 7 x64.

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#37
August 22, 2010 at 10:06:35
You were having major problems before you loaded XP.

Test the hard drive - see #32
.......

Go to Device Manager in XP and find the Vendor ID number of your Display adapter.

E.g.

RIGHT click on My Computer - Properties - Hardware - Device Manager

Open up the Display adapters category, RIGHT click on the name of the adapter, Properties, click on the Details tab.
That shows the PnP determined Vendor ID, no matter whether the right video drivers have been installed

E.g. on a desktop computer of mine, which has an ATI All-in- Wonder HD card in a slot

PCI/VEN_1002&DEV_9598&SUBSYS.......

9598 is the Vendor ID number, corresponding to the HD 3600 series (3650).


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#38
August 22, 2010 at 10:53:34
I was having some trouble while using 7 aswell yes, that's true, but they weren't at all alike, if that matters.

Yes, the whole line goes:

PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_9712&SUBSYS_FDE41179&REV_00\4&1E50BDA7&0&2808

Edit: Long test underway now btw.


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#39
August 22, 2010 at 12:18:24
Okay, update, the long test with the seagate cd stopped at 82%, some blue dos:ish text appeared up in front of the program. I thought it would resume or be done, but upon touching the touchpad, the computer started screaming with the kind of sound you get when holding too many buttons in at once. wth :S

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#40
August 22, 2010 at 12:56:31
Hmm. If the machine is in warantee I would put back the original software and return it to where is was purchased. Sounds like HD trouble to me.

EDIT:
Do you believe in Hocus Pokus? To my total surprise removing the power plug for a while fixed a long standing issue on my machine. Apparently it can reset the mobo. You would obviously have to remove the main battery too. Will it work for your issue? Not a hope in hell LOL.

EDIT 2. I see T&W mentioned this Hocus Pocus in #41 while I was typing the above edit.

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#41
August 22, 2010 at 13:14:30
Has this laptop been dropped, or have you spilled liquid on it ?

You may get a code generated by the program if there is something wrong with the drive, but what you described is not normal. Normally if you get a code, it's normal characters, and the long test should quit at that point.

Try the Seatools CD with another computer, if you can.
If you DO NOT get the same thing happening, then there's nothing wrong with the data on the CD.

By the way, the Seatools disk will be compatible with the most optical drives if it's a CD-R, or a DVD-R when the drive can read DVDs, rather than a CD-RW, DVD-RW, or another type of disk.
......

You could try
- eject the optical drive's tray, clean off the laser lens on it, when there's no disk on it, with a tissue or soft cloth

- remove the AC adapter connection and the main battery
- remove the hard drive, install it again
- remove the ram, wipe off it's contacts with a tissue or soft cloth, install it again, making sure the notch in the contact edge lines up with the bump in the slot(s).
- restore power to the laptop, try testing the hard drive again.

If you need instructions regarding removing and installing the ram, see the User's guide here under Drivers:
http://www.csd.toshiba.com/cgi-bin/...
..........

If you can't get through the Seatools test, then I suspect that either there is something wrong with your hard drive or with your laptop otherwise, and you should get a local place that's authourized to do warranty work on Toshiba laptops to analyze what is wrong with it.
If you have data on it you don't want to lose, it can be copied to elsewhere, one way or another, but make sure whoever works on it knows that you want to save that personal data, if possible (that's not normally covered under the warranty).

If it's only the hard drive that is bad, a place authorized to work on Toshiba laptops should be able to get the disks you / they need to re-load the original software installation, but you may have to wait for them to arrive, if they don't have the right ones in stock - meanwhile, they could load Windows 7 from scratch for you, on warranty.

When the new computer doesn't come with Recovery disks, there is almost always a program installed in the original brand name software installation with which you're supposed to make the Recovery disks while Windows and the computer is working properly.


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#42
August 22, 2010 at 13:15:45
Yeah Derek, I was just sitting here thinking about returning it. Thing is, I removed the recovery-partition, and I don't have the box anymore (I do however got the ID/product code cut out from the box and I got the receipt). But what should I say? Do I need to demonstrate in some way?

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#43
August 22, 2010 at 13:19:08
See my EDITS to #40.

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#44
August 22, 2010 at 13:22:56
@ Tubesandwires

Not spilled on nor dropped. I burnt the Seatools on a CD-RW.
As it is now, I'm gonna go for another windows 7 installation just to see if it starts acting weird. Then return it. Since the computer got a one year warranty I got alot of time to return it as I see fit.

@ Derek:

I'll try and see if the magic works. ;) Should I remove the battery while it's on or simply pop it out while it's off, then put it back in and start the comp?

@ all who has taken time to answer:

Thanks for the patience and support so far, you guys are awesome


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#45
August 22, 2010 at 13:35:45
Power it off first then unplug mains lead and remove battery. Give it a few minutes for the Hocus Pokus to work before putting humpty together again in reverse order. If this does any good then I'm a monkeys uncle.....

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#46
August 22, 2010 at 13:37:40
It could be the data on the CD is corrupted, or the particular optical drive doesn't get along with the particular brand of CD-RW disk.
Try the CD with another computer, or burn it again on a CD-R rather than a CD-RW, try the CD-R.

If your hard drive is failing, or if there's something else wrong with the laptop, it's a waste of your time installing software, especially when it's already had Win 7 installed on it once and XP installed on it three times.


Never remove the main battery while the computer is running.


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#47
August 22, 2010 at 13:41:20
This had just got to be a hardware issue but one good reason to try and put back Win 7 is because returning the computer with XP on it might raise far too many eyebrows.

Suppliers are quite good at trying to blame customers, so it's best not to play into their hands.

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#48
August 22, 2010 at 13:48:28
@ Derek:

Well.. it'll be ultimate x86 then, which wasn't standard anyway, without recovery-partition. x)


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#49
August 22, 2010 at 13:57:51
Well, I guess so if that was originally on there. It's just possible they won't even bother to switch the machine on but you never know.

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#50
August 22, 2010 at 14:21:46
No, you misunderstand, the ultimate x86 disc is something I had myself, originally it was windows 7 home I believe

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#51
August 22, 2010 at 15:19:48
Aha, looks like slipped into misunderstanding mode.

What I was after was restoring things back to the way they were when the machine was purchased. If you are saying that you can't because you no longer have the restore partiton then I can see your dilema.

If that's the case then I really don't know. I guess you are gonna have to throw up that decision coin and hope for the best.

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#52
August 23, 2010 at 07:11:15
Im not ready to believe in the hokus pokus just yet, but it's been running since yesterday without slipping back into pio-mode. It probably will soon enough but one can always hope..
About the seatools test, it worked perfectly on my stationary which is both older and more used, so nothing wrong with the cd atleast.

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#53
August 23, 2010 at 09:23:31
Yeah, agreed about Hokus Pokus. What it did for me (most definitely) is get shot of an Unknown USB Device showing under Device Manager USB's, which should have been showing as Generic USB Hub. The pair of them kept coming and going. Eventually I found this fix on the web which even surprised the author, who had tried about everything else.

So, not a bit like your issue but grabbing simple straws like that cost nothing I suppose.

Whatever, I'll be interested to know how you get on but with intermittent faults only time can really tell if they have really gone away - but I don't need to tell you that LOL.

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#54
August 23, 2010 at 14:02:24
It took about 24hours before it f---ed off into Pio mode, this time it gave up a beep-computer-sound whilst lag commenced. Bah. Will continue with the plans for windows 7 again and see how that fares, cause I don't currently have time to return it nor can I be arsed to do anything about it just yet. Will do it in the beginning of oktober if so, going away whole september.

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#55
August 23, 2010 at 14:23:20
Whatever this is, as it has happened even with other OS's clean installed it smells very much like a hardware issue - HDD maybe but who knows!

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#56
August 24, 2010 at 10:05:50
Yeah, even so it won't matter much to me if it gets more worn out, more evidence of hardware failure for the store. ;)

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#57
August 24, 2010 at 11:06:50
You could try a hard drive diagnostic program other than Seatools, however
- I've seen a few systems the bootable Seatools will not run on , but in those cases it would not load.
- if the hard drive is a Toshiba model, Toshiba doesn't provide any diagnostics program for their drives.
- most if not all diagnostics programs you get from hard drive manufacturer's web sites, other than Seagate's Seatools, can't be used unless at least one detected hard drive attached to the computer is their brand.

There is a Windows version of Seatools you could try, but of course Windows has to be working normally enough.


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#58
August 24, 2010 at 12:15:34
Hitachi's drive fitness utility is said to work with any hard drive. Can't verify that myself though.

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