nForce2 MCP / athlon xp barton

Micro-star international / Axda2600dkv4d
January 14, 2009 at 15:33:54
Specs: Windows XP, athlon xp
Good evening.

So I went and spent 10 euros in the old man's shop and came home with an MS-6667 board. Turns out it has another name too, K7N2GM-IL. I wanted it for that athlon xp cpu I had here, which turns out to be a Barton. Is it true they run cooler than the thoroughbreds?

So I hooked up the setup, and i got no beeps, no post. reset the cmos, and got beeps. reset it again, got beeps.. no post. so I removed the agp ati i had in, and plugged the monitor into the onboard video out. reset cmos, and this time it's ON. I have the jumper for fsb 133/166 shorted, and so it sees my cpu as it should. It's confusing to me how this nforce2 chipset uses the same jumper for 133/166. those are two different rates. either way, I'm in bios. i wonder what's up with the agp. bios is weird, not weird but more complex. so a little help from experts on nforce2 will be greatly appreciated (wink) :) where do I start? Bios shows a 2003 date. bios update? is that needed?

this board has a video out thing, and i unplugged it for now. then the two ram slots have different colors. is only one of them dual channel ?

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


See More: nForce2 MCP / athlon xp barton

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#1
January 14, 2009 at 15:45:28
i went and set the first display to be agp. then put the radeon back in. i see flashing colored squares. broken agp ?

i went to bios and the cpu bus speed was on 100 for some reason, i've moved it to 166. runs fine. is that normal, since i've had the jumper set to 133/166 already? why did it say 100? I also set the high performance feature to on, just to see if it works. it works.

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#2
January 14, 2009 at 15:49:22
agp voltage is set to 1.5v is that good for the ati 9250 ?

dram voltage is set to 2.6v. is that ok ? i thought it was supposed to be 3.3

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#3
January 14, 2009 at 16:01:34
:)) i put in an nvidia agp card, and it works. go figure, i guess nvidia chipsets won't hear of ATI ? LOL

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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Related Solutions

#4
January 14, 2009 at 17:14:10
Ah yes, where to begin?

1st of all, congrats on getting the socket 7 board/CPU straightened around. Now on to new endeavours....

I didn't pay too much attention to your CPU model number before but the "4" means that it's definitely a Barton. And as much as I like the nForce2 chipset, the board you got only supports 333MHz FSB. I guess it's no big deal though because you only have a 333MHz FSB CPU. Remember to always maintain a 1:1 ratio so either DDR333 RAM should be used or DDR400 underclocked to DDR333 speed (166MHz). Your board can run the RAM in dual channel mode, but there's no performance advantage doing so. If you want me to go thru the mathematical calculations as to why, just ask & I will.

I just downloaded the manual & gave it a quick look. It appears that your board *may* be overclockable to 200MHz. I doubt your CPU can handle it but you never know. Here's some settings to get you started:

System Performance = manual
CPU FSB Clock = 175MHz
CPU Interface = normal
FSB/DRAM Ratio = 1:1
Memory Timings = manual
T-(RAS) = 11
T-(RCD) = 3
T-(RP) = 3
CAS Latency = 2.5
FSB Spread Spectrum = disabled
AGP Spread Spectrum = disabled
AGP Aperture Size = 128MB
Frame Buffer Size = disabled if using AGP card
TV-Out Mode = disabled unless you have the adapter & plan on using it

Init Display First = AGP

Onboard devices -- disable what you don't need, for example: modem

PNP OS Installed = no

AGP Clock Control = manual
AGP Clock Value = 67MHz

Unfortunately, I didn't see a setting to adjust CPU voltage...that will limit your overclockability. If you go with the above settings, your CPU will run at approx 2012MHz with the RAM in sync at 175MHz (DDR350). Assuming you use DDR400 & that you wanna overclock even higher, all you have to do is raise the CPU FSB Clock, you do NOT have to touch any of the other settings. Raise the FSB in 5MHz increments (180, 185, 190, etc), save & exit, then boot into Windows & test for stability. If all is well, reboot, enter the BIOS, add another 5MHz & repeat the process. If the system becomes unstable, simply back off to your last stable setting. Since there's no way to increase the CPU voltage, you're done. If you over-overclock & the system refuses to boot, you'll have to reset the system. The manual explains on page 2-25:

If your computer hang while overclocking, please reset J4 to safe mode and reboot. After rebooting, enter BIOS Setup menu to reload the BIOS Setup Defaults and reset J4 to user mode.

(Skip & I just helped someone with that exact issue in the CPU forum. I believe he had the same board)

One last thing, if you feel comfortable flashing the BIOS, do it before you begin overclocking.


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#5
January 14, 2009 at 17:20:58
"agp voltage is set to 1.5v is that good for the ati 9250?"

Don't mess with the AGP voltage, leave it at 1.5v.

"dram voltage is set to 2.6v. is that ok ? i thought it was supposed to be 3.3"

DDR-SDRAM (DDR266, DDR333, DDR400) runs between 2.5v - 2.7v. Older SDR-SDRAM (PC100, PC133) runs at 3.3v.


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#6
January 14, 2009 at 17:27:17
Here's an old thread that mentions single vs dual channel on a socket A system:

http://www.computing.net/answers/cp...


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#7
January 14, 2009 at 22:24:23
"Your board can run the RAM in dual channel mode, but there's no performance advantage doing so. If you want me to go thru the mathematical calculations as to why, just ask & I will."

Well, for one thing, I don't think that's my choice. When I had one 512mb stick in there, it said single channel. Then I added a 256mb stick, and now it says dual channel. I see no option for disabling that.

I always say it's best to doublecheck.

"One last thing, if you feel comfortable flashing the BIOS, do it before you begin overclocking"

well would it change anything, would you do it ?


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#8
January 14, 2009 at 23:10:31
I went and set all the bios values as advised, and alas, it works as you said it would. now should I install xp as is, or should I revert to normal settings, then after xp is installed, oc back ?

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#9
January 15, 2009 at 05:19:47
jam, I have a question for you on the settings you suggest. Why no PNP OS? I'm not debating the issue, just wondering.

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#10
January 15, 2009 at 05:23:48
I didn't mean that you should avoid or disable dual channel mode...if it kicks in with the RAM you have, that's fine. What I meant was don't go out of your way to enable it because there's no real advantage to it, at least not on a socket A system.

"flashing the BIOS...would you do it ?"

Yes, I would. The latest BIOS available has a 2004 date & there were several fixes/updates made between the initial release & last.

http://global.msi.com.tw/index.php?...

"now should I install xp as is, or should I revert to normal settings, then after xp is installed, oc back ?"

If you wanna play it safe, all you'd have to do is change the FSB from 175MHz back to 166MHz...all the other settings can stay as they are. I would test the RAM with memtest86 before installing Windows though.

http://www.memtest86.com/download.html

Here's a couple of other programs that should come in handy. Use CPUZ to confirm your settings:

http://www.cpuid.com/cpuz.php

And use OCCT to run load/stability tests. It also provides info about your CPU settings, PSU voltages & should display the CPU temp as well:

http://www.ocbase.com/perestroika_e...


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#11
January 15, 2009 at 05:32:51
"Why no PNP OS?"

You want the BIOS to configure the hardware, not the OS.

http://www.techarp.com/showFreeBOG....


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#12
January 15, 2009 at 05:39:31
I understand that will happen. I don't understand why it is preferable to have the BIOS configure.

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#13
January 15, 2009 at 07:39:09
ok, there seems to be some kind of problem somewhere with the board or bios. as i've done all the settings thru the last 24hrs, i've noticed something. i leave the board here on my desk on a piece of sponge, all good, all settings okay, boots fine. i come back after say.. 4 hours, and i go to boot it. it makes a long beep, repeatedly, and i have to move the J4 from 1-2 to 2-3, boot, go into bios, save and exit, then return the jumper to 1-2 which is the normal position. after that, it's all good again, i can boot a million times, i'll get no beeps, and all is fine. any thoughts ? i was thinking cmos battery ?

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#14
January 15, 2009 at 08:09:13
If you haven't damaged the board yet stop doing that. Applying power with the jumper in the clear position is a NO NO.

The correct procedure is to unplug power or move the PSU switch to the off position. Then move the jumper from 1&2 to 2&3 for 5 seconds. Move the jumper back to 1&2. Then restore power and boot to the BIOS and reset values.

You should get one short beep when you first start the board.


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#15
January 15, 2009 at 08:10:40
i'm thinking it could have been the 256mb ram stick. i removed it, and shut down and will try in 2-3 hrs to see if the problem is gone.

it has bios version 1.5b2 on it now, the latest available is 1.6. my question is, would i update its bios via the utility listed on the first pages of the manual ? look at 1-2 thru 1-7 or so please.

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#16
January 15, 2009 at 08:18:24
othehill, J4 is not the clearcmos jumper. i'd never do that. J4 is a propietary jumper to this kind of mobo, i've never seen it before, it reverts settings to safe boot, or something. let me quote from the manual:
"if system fails to boot while oc-ing, put J4 on safe mode (100FSB), boot, then shut down and put J4 back on user mode"

thing is, i wasn't oc-ed at the time it occured.

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#17
January 15, 2009 at 08:27:42
OK then, my mistake. If you are generating an audible error sometimes then I think you should hear a single beep at a good POST.

The way to tell if the CMOS battery is no good is to set the time and date and then shut down, and disconnect power to the computer. Reconnect power and boot to the BIOS. If the time and date have reverted back to the date of the BIOS version then the battery is not working.

Could be installed wrong or simply drained. As long as power to the computer is maintained the CMOS settings are saved because there is always some power to the board with an ATX system.

edit

One other thing to note. You may still be performing that reset wrong. Seems to me that the jumper in question is still acting as a clear CMOS jumper. Maybe just not clearing all values.

I would guess you shouldn't be powering up with it in the clear position unless the manual instructs to do that.


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#18
January 15, 2009 at 08:31:57
oh. so if i don't unplug the psu or don't turn the psu switch to 0, the board has enough power to save cmos settings, even if the battery is dead. isee, ok i'll set the time and see what happens. thanks for the info.

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#19
January 15, 2009 at 08:38:18
"my question is, would i update its bios via the utility listed on the first pages of the manual ?"

Download the BIOS update package, unzip it, then read the instructions.

"I would guess you shouldn't be powering up with it in the clear position unless the manual instructs to do that."

Actually, the manual does say to do it that way. 1st time I've run across it was a few days ago when answering another question in the CPU forum. I mentioned it in response #4:

If your computer hang while overclocking, please reset J4 to safe mode and reboot. After rebooting, enter BIOS Setup menu to reload the BIOS Setup Defaults and reset J4 to user mode.


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#20
January 15, 2009 at 08:43:59
yep well we all got that J4 issue straight, it's not a clearcmos anyway. it just resets the fsb to 100 so u can boot.

i took out the battery and licked it, no tongue sting at all. a 3v battery has to sting, at least feel 'salty' in the sting. then i figured why be a retard and lick old cr2032s, and put my tester on it :)) zero volts, damn thing is dead. i just replaced it and will now retry booting see if i got over that one problem.

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#21
January 15, 2009 at 08:45:58
jam, how do you copy/paste from pdf? i've noticed it above, .. haven't really used pdf to an extent before so i don't know how. if i try selecting by leftclick on the text, the little hand pointer grabs the page to move up/down :)

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#22
January 15, 2009 at 08:46:58
"so if i don't unplug the psu or don't turn the psu switch to 0, the board has enough power to save cmos settings, even if the battery is dead"

Exactly. The battery's only purpose is to keep power to the CMOS chip so that the BIOS settings are retained in memory during no power conditions. If you simply shutdown the PC (not unplug or switch off the PSU), the standby voltage (+5VSB) does the same thing. That's why you should always unplug the PSU when resetting the BIOS (clear CMOS).


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#23
January 15, 2009 at 08:53:39
"how do you copy/paste from pdf?"

It depends on the program you're using. Try going to the toolbar & next to the hand, there should be a "select" icon...it looks like an I-beam with an arrow next to it...click on it, then see if you can copy text. Some PDF files are locked to prevent you from doing so, this particular manual is not.

"if i try selecting by leftclick on the text, the little hand pointer grabs the page to move up/down"

Try right clicking & see if you have the option to change from the hand to the "I-beam"


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#24
January 15, 2009 at 08:57:54
rob

Are you asking how to copy something from a site on the net?

Most times all you need to do is place the cursor at the beginning of desired text or graphics. Then left click and hold. Drag the cursor over the desired area/text. release the left button and area should stay highlighted. Right click on any highlight area and choose copy. Then place the cursor where you wish to paste and right click and select paste.

You can't paste graphics into this forum.

If you want to do multiple items then open your word processor and paste it there.

If you want to print just the highlighted text/graphics then go to file at the top left corner and choose print> selection. There may be a keystroke combination for that action but I don't know it.


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#25
January 15, 2009 at 09:05:12
othehill :) no man, i was asking how to copy/paste from acrobat reader, that's what opens up this manual. okay, got it, thanks. select tool worked. proof:
MSI Reminds You...
If your computer hang while overclocking, please reset J4 to
safe mode and reboot. After rebooting, enter BIOS Setup menu
to reload the BIOS Setup Defaults and reset J4 to user mode.

:) okay, beep at boot problem = gone. it was the crappy battery.

now hooking up a hard drive to the system.

-bios upgrade move.. when ? after xp is installed?

jam said "Download the BIOS update package, unzip it, then read the instructions." so that means install xp first so i can download something with the machine right ?

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#26
January 15, 2009 at 09:15:05
"so that means install xp first so i can download something with the machine right ?"

No, if you're going to update the BIOS anyway, I would do it 1st. The same BIOS update method I described in your other post will work, but check the "how to" file after you unzip the BIOS package just to be sure.


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#27
January 15, 2009 at 09:15:31
Do you have a floppy drive installed on that system? You will need it. Flash the BIOS BEFORE installing Windows.

Be sure to get the correct bin file and flash utility for your EXACT model and version of board. Use a new, clean floppy with no bad sectors. Flash in good weather and when no chance of a power interruption.

After setting up the floppy as instructed in the flash instructions and you start you will be given the option to save the old files. Do that. Be sure you only copy the necessary files to the floppy so there is room for the lld file, you may need it.

DO NOT interrupt the process once it has started.

All the above is irrelevant if the only flash files are to be performed from within Windows. With an nForce2 board I don't think that is the case.


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#28
January 15, 2009 at 09:21:23
ok but the manual boasts about an utility within the mainboard cd, that installs bios+drivers online from windows. is that the crappy way to do it then ? ok i'll download the bios file. can I use the same winME boot diskette i used for the p5mvp3?

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#29
January 15, 2009 at 09:28:50
IMO if you have the option to flash from a boot floppy that is the better method. You may not have that option. Depends on the format of the flash files.

Either way, follow the rest of the advise about avoiding any possibility of a power interruption and saving the old file, if possible.


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#30
January 15, 2009 at 09:32:28
rob, just download the zip file, unzip it & read the instructions. All your questions will be answered. Then do it my way...lol ;-)

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#31
January 15, 2009 at 13:23:09
i'm not even gonna tell you guys what I did. I'll tell you tomorrow, only if it gets fixed. Hopefully it will I called someone they said they can help. I'm a lazy dumbass and I never seem to learn my lesson. I did some redecorating in one of my stores today, and took my tools with me. Along with them, the modified flathead large screwdriver I usually use for heatsinks on socket A. came back, left toolbox in my car. Came in here (this is my office at home where I spend 4-5hrs daily), got on the forum, etc, then time came for me to change heatsink+fan to something better, and I used a flathead I had laying around here.. slipped right into on of them small resistor/diodes I don't know what they are, around the northbridge. Luckily nothing else got touched. But that one piece split in half. are those diodes? or surface-mount resistors? Either way, called my electronics guy, said he has them, and he'll take care of it for me tomorrow. I'm mad as hell.

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#32
January 15, 2009 at 13:28:54
You mean you did something else dumb besides the story you just told, LOL?

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#33
January 15, 2009 at 13:58:04
Yikes! Here's a tip for...don't use a screwdriver, it can slip. Instead, use an appropriate size nutdriver.

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#34
January 15, 2009 at 13:58:09
:P

I know how that feels.

This is your fourth (?) 20+ thread this week? Congrats! :-)

Homebuilt projector:
Samsung 1080p panel
Pixelworks controller
2 HDMI, 2 Component, 1 VGA
Homebuilt enclosure
120" 16:9 screen
Connected to: HTPC w/ BD, satellite receiver, XB360.


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#35
January 15, 2009 at 14:00:05
no .. that was it, i told it after all. maybe someone can give me a safe tip for the future, maybe altering that dumb bracket from the socket a heatsinks in some way. bending it lower before the mount, something? it's ridiculous how much pressure on has to apply on it to clinch in.

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#36
January 15, 2009 at 14:51:35
"maybe someone can give me a safe tip for the future"

I already did...use an appropriate sized nut driver (1/4" or thereabouts) instead of a screwdriver, that way it can't slip off the metal tang.


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#37
January 15, 2009 at 15:29:19
Yep, a nutdriver; no pliers, no screwdriver, no chopsticks, tire irons, gun cleaning rods...

Skip


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#38
January 15, 2009 at 15:37:06
nutdriver?

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#39
January 15, 2009 at 15:39:36
http://www.stanleytools.com/default...

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#40
January 15, 2009 at 16:42:35
http://cart.clockparts.com/images/i...

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#41
January 15, 2009 at 17:31:24
how in the hell would I get that into the flathead screwdriver slit in the bracket though ? i know what a nutdriver is.

-when i come home tomorrow, i'll have that mobo working, as well as my other one, the epox ep-8rda3ipro. which of these is a better board overall ? they both have the nforce2. i heard the epox has a backup bios onboard.. is that true ?

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#42
January 15, 2009 at 18:46:50
The Epox is the better board:

http://www.epox.com/usa/product.asp...

"flathead screwdriver slit"

We must be using different types of heatsinks because I just had a look at a few of mine & they all have a "curled tang" that I can hook the edge of the nutdriver on.


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#43
January 16, 2009 at 03:32:58
heatsink type is one thing, but the brackets i have obviously are lowend.

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#44
January 16, 2009 at 11:57:47
"...& they all have a "curled tang"..."

Mine too, although I do have an old Socket 370 retainer that only has a small tab angled out from the retainer. Too small to get a nutdriver over.

I just threw it in the trash as I usually use old cheapo socket A heatsinks on the Intel 370's. I destroyed one motherboard with a screwdriver and I'll not do it again.

Skip


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#45
January 16, 2009 at 15:20:17
well i left the mobos there to get fixed, dude assured me i'll have them both back tomorrow. so i'll report back then. all the best.

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#46
January 17, 2009 at 13:59:11
back, with mobo fixed. just the one in this thred. the epox seems to have a dead southbridge. i'm still glad the man had the skill and fixed the msi. so i'll get on to the bios upgrade now, and post back. :)

in the meantime, i'll start a new topic about my daughter's system, which is sluggish for reasons unknown to me. i'll bet it's something to do with the ram:cpu fsb ratios or something along those lines.
I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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#47
January 17, 2009 at 15:50:58
Out of curiosity how much did it cost you to fix the motherboard?

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#48
January 17, 2009 at 15:55:42
it didn't cost me anything. dude's my boy's godson and we do each other certain favors.. nothing to do with IT. but i swear the man has skills. he sat there for like 45min with the epox.. changed 2 transistors, this and that, and had a cpu tester stuck in the cpu socket, and another digital thing plugged into the pci slot :) and that damn thing kept lighting up codes. and he was reading the codes to me.

I always say it's best to doublecheck.


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