Model 8172 running XPSP3 and a Dual Core

January 28, 2011 at 17:58:18
Specs: Windows XP, P4/2GB
I am running an IBM Model 8172 SSF work station with XP SP3, Dual Core P4 cpu (3.0 GHz) and 2 GB of DDR RAM. I am considering replacing one of the 1 GB sticks with a 2 GB stick of RAM for a total of 3 GB. Will 3 GB of RAM work in this machine? Thank you for your input.

tomurbanski


See More: Model 8172 running XPSP3 and a Dual Core

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#1
January 30, 2011 at 13:27:56
Since I posted the above, I have a little information. The Pentium P4 is a 530/530J/ with an Intel 915G Chipset. The computer has 2 memory slots. Hope this helps.

Tom


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#2
January 30, 2011 at 13:34:43
According to the specs 2 gigs is all she'll handle.

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#3
January 30, 2011 at 13:53:05
"Will 3 GB of RAM work in this machine?"

NO.

You have two ram slots, a max of a 1gb module can be installed in each slot.

2gb is already a decent amount of ram for most people's uses.
If your computer is running slower than it once did, there are lots of things that can cause that, that have nothing to do with the amount of ram .

You can look up which ram modules you can install in your mboard and part numbers of modules that will work in it for sure by using your make and model number on ram manufacturer or ram distributor web sites that have a ram configurator program or similar.

E.g. on the Crucial web site

There's a ram configurator on the first page you see

http://www.crucial.com

I found:

IBM ThinkCentre S Series Type 8171 All Models
http://www.crucial.com/store/listpa...

on the Kingston web site...

http://www.kingston.com

There's a ram configurator on the first page you see, but this site uses software that sometimes chops off the really long link to results,

so, here's an alternative that always works

go here:
http://www.ec.kingston.com/ecom/con...

Manufacturer: IBM / Lenovo
Model: 8172
Search

Lenovo ThinkCentre S51 8171, 8172, 8173-xxx
Search

(the same ram can be used in the 8171, 8172, 8173 models)


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Related Solutions

#4
January 31, 2011 at 08:39:24
Thank you for your reply. I was afraid that was the case. I was somewhat confused by the Intel Data Sheet for the 82915(G), Section 1.3.2 (System Memory Interface) which states in one part "Available Bandwidth up to 3.2 GB's (DDR/DDR2 400) and also:

"In a 32-bit system, only the first 4 GB of memory will be accessible". My computer runs fine. My reason for adding more RAM is to attain better frame rates in a rather graphics intensive Train Simulator (TRAINZ 2009) by NV3 Games. Don't try it, it is addictive.

Tom Urbanski


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#5
January 31, 2011 at 09:49:04
Adding more ram won't significantly increase frame rates, but if you have a mboard slot a video card can be installed in, buying a better video card and installing it will help a lot, especially if you have a PCI-E X 16 slot or AGP slot available.

However, you may need to get a power supply with more capacity.

Your power supply must have at least the minimum capacity required to support a system with the graphics card you are using installed, or the max graphics card you might install in the future.
(Onboard video - video built into the mboard - IS NOT A CARD ! )
If that info is not in the ad for the video card, you can go to the video card maker's web site and look up the specs for the model - often under system requirements - the minimum PS wattage, and, more important, the minimum amperage the PS must supply at 12v is stated. If you don't find that, any card with the same video chipset including any letters after the model number has very similar minimum PS requirements. Some power supplies have two or more +12v ratings - in that case, add those ratings to determine the total +12v current capacity.

If you're a gamer...
In most if not all cases, the max capacity rating of the PS is an intermittent rating. It's recommended that you do not load your PS to any more that 80% of that rating if you are going to be using something that puts a constant load on it, such as playing a recent game for hours on end. In that case, you multiply the min capacity stated for the system with the particular video chipset on the card by 1.25 to find the min. capacity of the PS you should get.

If you need to get a PS with more capacity, you can usually replace it with any decent quality standard sized standard ATX PS.

Standard (PS/2) power supply size - 86mm high, 150mm wide, 140mm deep, or 3 3/8" h x 5 7/8" w x 5 1/2" d , or very close to that, though the depth can be more or less for some PSs.

Don't buy an el-cheapo (in quality) PS.
See response 3 in this:
http://www.computing.net/answers/ha...


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#6
January 31, 2011 at 10:32:12
Thanks again for the input. I have installed the best available Graphics card for the 8172 which is Zotec 512 MB card SFF using the PCIe X1 slot and the nVidea ION chip. This card (with fan) only draws 18 watts Total load of my system using a watt meter 100 <> 110 watts. . My X16 slot has a slot limiting cover so only an X1 card will work. As I noted, the computer run very well and is built like an army tank. In the Train simulator most typical routes run fine with 10/30 FPS. Recently, some new routes have been made available for download covering 70 to 80+ route miles and 1,000's of scenery items. It is these that my modest system struggles with. I guess that I have reached the limits with this system (built in 05 and purchased used by me in 08). As they say, "You can't get blood from a stone". Thank again and take care.

Tom Urbanski


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#7
January 31, 2011 at 14:10:24
"the PCIe X1 slot ..." "... My X16 slot has a slot limiting cover"

Huh ?
I looked at the manuals for the 8172
http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/s...
and it seems it has only two PCI slots, on a riser card, and the case appears to be able to have full height cards installed, horizontally.
Are you sure you quoted the right model number ?


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#8
January 31, 2011 at 16:24:18
Go here http://download.lenovo.com/ibmdl/pu...

then scroll to top of Pg 17. Riser has one PCI slot and one PCIe x1 slot. It does not show, but there is a removable slotted cover over the x1 slot. Presumably to prevent insertion of an X16 card which will fit the slot, but not operate. I know this for a fact because I did try using a standard x16 Graphics card.

Regards, Tom


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#9
January 31, 2011 at 20:11:09
Ok, I see that now. You'd think that would be shown elsewhere as well - I looked all over in four manuals, but I didn't search for PCI-E - otherwise, the manuals are very good.
I also see on that page that it has only a 225 watt power supply. There's not many better video chipsets that would be okay with only that. It appears to be a standard sized power supply, however.

I've never heard of a NVidia ION video chip before.
There probably are better video chipsets available on PCI-E X1 cards you could buy, if you're willing to upgrade the PS.


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#10
February 1, 2011 at 07:38:21
This is the Zotec card http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ... that I have. It has decent specs for an x1 card. I previously was using an nVidia NVS 295x1 fanless work station card. The Zotec has better specs, however after the swap any performance difference was minimal. Video cards for the x1 slot are few in number. and work station cards can get very expensive. I agree that the PS is wimpy, but with 110W peak current draw under load it is not working very hard. I use a program called "Speed Fan" to keep tabs on things. By the way, my PS is marked 230W on the sticker, not that it makes much difference. It may have been replaced at some point, but not by me. These were and are very good computers, built for 24/7 operation and much better than some of the over priced junk sold at the big box stores.

Regards, Tom


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#11
February 1, 2011 at 10:22:06
Did you need to use the low profile bracket with that card on the 8712, or were you able to use the regular height / length bracket ?
There are more PCI-E cards to choose from if you can install a card using aregular bracket.

I know from experience and looking up things
- PCI-E X1 cards do NOT have a max data transfer rate 1/16nth of that of the same video chipset on a PCI-E X16 card - it ain't all that much less.
- that looking for PCI-E X1cards can be frustrating unless they're listed in a separate category on a web site.

There are other PCI-E X1 cards listed there:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...

HD 4350 - 300 watt or higher PS capacity.
However, it seems to me I read at several places on the web that it doesn't actually require that min PS capacity - it will work fine with a system that has a 250 watt PS

HD 5450 - 400 watt or higher PS capacity

I don't know how the HD 4350 compares to the NVidia ION video chipset, but the 5450 would definiely improve your max fps rates.

I have saved other examples if you're interested.


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#12
February 1, 2011 at 19:38:29
The 8172 uses the regular height bracket. In fact I had to switch brackets and install the VGA port as the Zotac comes with the low profile bracket installed. The 5450 would definitely be an improvement, however the price of the 5450 equals the cost of the computer when I purchased it in 2008, not to mention the cost of a PS to run it. I am now taking another approach by systematically going through the programs built-in data base and disabling objects intended for European, Asian or Australian Routes that I do not use. This amounts to thousands of files and should substantially reduce the load on the entire system and hopefully improve performance. I noticed that the cards that you found use ATI chipsets. For reasons that are not too clear the TRAINZ program seems to prefer nVidia chipsets to ATI. That is, TRAINZ users with ATI chipsets report many more (video) issues and problems in running the program than nVidia users.

Thanks and take care, Tom


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#13
February 1, 2011 at 21:37:30
"I noticed that the cards that you found use ATI chipsets."

I merely used site location info at the top of the page you provided the link to for your card on the newegg site to find all the PCI-E x1 cards they list .

I will admit that I know more about ATI video chipsets than NVidia ones, and I prefer ATI ones. I have been buying cards with ATI video chipsets since the late 80's. I'm Canadian, and up until about 2000, all video cards with ATI video chipsets were made in Canada.

" For reasons that are not too clear the TRAINZ program seems to prefer nVidia chipsets to ATI. That is, TRAINZ users with ATI chipsets report many more (video) issues and problems in running the program than nVidia users."

Unfortunately, some programs are optimized for use with NVidia video chipsets, some are optimized for use with ATI video chipsets. Better written programs will work fine with either, because they tried the program with both types of video chipsets and have eliminated the problems.


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#14
February 2, 2011 at 07:42:03
Thanks for your response and insight into the ATI/nVidia issue. I suspected that was the case with TRAINZ, but needed someone like yourself to confirm it. Also thanks for mentioning that your Canadian. I live outside of Buffalo and can be in Fort Erie via the Peace Bridge enjoying a LaBatts or Molson's or a round of golf in the summer in about 20 minutes. Returning home is another issue because of US Customs and security delays.

Tom


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#15
February 2, 2011 at 08:12:24
Up until about 2000, all video cards with ATI video chipsets were made in Ontario, in Toronto, or near Toronto ??
I live in Alberta, and the only place I have been to in the US is Seattle, once, way back when I was 12.

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#16
February 2, 2011 at 10:21:22
Ahh Toronto. Toronto is like a sister city to Buffalo being only 90 minutes away by car. In hockey, there is a friendly rivalry between Toronto Maple Leaf and Buffalo Sabre fans. On most weekends, our shopping malls are filled with Canadians taking advantage of the exchange rate and lower prices. Until recently, border crossings were a breeze taking under 5 minutes. The only questions asked were: "Where are you going?" and "When do expect to return?". Unfortunately, 9/11 changed all that, probably forever.

I did want to ask you about your user name "tubesandwires". Do you mean as in vacuum tubes? If that is the case, then you are probably close to my age (74). Years ago I used to restore old (1930's and 40's) radios as a hobby. I sort of gave that up as tubes and other components became scarce and somewhat expensive.

Regards, Tom


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#17
February 2, 2011 at 12:05:43
"I did want to ask you about your user name "tubesandwires". Do you mean as in vacuum tubes?"

Yes.
I'm 59.
It was a nick name given to be by a friend. He had no music system at the time, so I rigged up a stereo system for him that was assembled from a multiposition multiple pole switch and wiring and two ~10 watt r.m.s. mono vacuum tube receivers that used to be in old console cabinets, one an Electrohome, the other an RCA. The only thing he did have was a pair of large speakers.

Years previous to that our family used the same two mono consoles, intact, for years in our basement along with a Sony 7" reel to reel stereo tape player / recorder, and a Garrard stereo turntable, the same one I lent to the friend. Both consoles had mono turntables and AM radio . The consoles were on either end of one side of the basement "rumpus room" which was the full length of the basement.
Our parents allowed us four kids - one pre-teen and 3 teens - to have friends come over and make a reasonable amount of noise playing music downstairs, up to a reasonable time in the evening, as long as they were home. (We never had parties when they weren't home, which was rare.) Kids who had stereos at home but could not play them as loud as they wanted due to their parents wishes loved to come over to our place.

Way back, I took a 3 year electronics course in high school. Vacuum tube receivers, amplifiers, and TVs were common then, and transistorized full size of the same things were a relatively recent thing. In the last year of the course we learned abount integrated chips, which were a very new thing.

I have repaired a few vacuum tube things, but not many.

My Dad (he's 85) used to collect antique radios, refinishing their cabinets when they were in poor shape, but he has given them all away except for one large one - a Victor Radio model - he has two sets of the two modules for that.
.....

By the way....
I have a bunch of repair manuals for old radios that were given to me by a son of one of two brothers (he was a friend of my brother) - the Cable brothers - that had a long time business here - they were going to throw them away, so he gave them to me because he thought I might eventually find someone who would be interested in having them.


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#18
February 2, 2011 at 16:56:22
That is a great and interesting story. Those old radio chassis were really built well. But as you said, the cabinetry was frequently abused, placed in damp basements or even left outdoors on the back porch. I have not seen one in really good shape (un-restored) in over 20 years. My schooling was in civil engineering, but I always had an interest in electronics. What little I know came from some ICS electronics courses that I took in the late 50's to early 60's and building some kits. Remember those? In fact, I built most of test equipment from kits.
I think my experience working on those old radios made me appreciate well built equipment like the IBM/Lenovo work stations. Actually, I have two of them. However, the other one is basically stock with 1 GB of RAM and the on-board Intel chipset. I use it primarily for general computing and surfing the net. There are no games installed on that one, just programs like word and excel. My wife also uses it on occasion. Both puters are linked with a router and modem.
At the rate technology is moving, it won't be too long before both of these gems will be boat anchors or museum pieces.

Tom


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#19
February 2, 2011 at 21:09:52
I remember seeing and reading the ICS ads in magazines.

I set up my high school courses so that I could either go to a technical institute and get a year off credit (because of my electronics course in high school) for an electronics technician course, it was normally 2 or 3 years at the time, I forget which, or go to University and take Science and possibly pre-med - I chose the latter and got through two years but didn't finish, it was too tough - sometimes I think I should have chosen the former. I should have tried one or the other again within a few years, but I didn't. Eventually I became a journeyman carpenter, and handyman, but my back problems have forced me to stop doing that.

How about Heathkits ? I built a vehicle strobe timing light, my Dad built a vehicle oscilloscope of theirs. Both still work.


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#20
February 3, 2011 at 14:35:10
Very sorry to hear about your back problem. I know from experience (lower back spasms) just how painful and debilitating that can be. I always admired the Heathkits for their quality and advanced designs. One of my goals was to build one of their TV sets but I never did. I could not justify the expense at the time (newly married and family obligations). I compromised on some EICO kits and ended up building a 140W stereo AM/FM receiver which worked flawlessly until I gave it away two years ago. Also built some EICO test equipment, such as the tube tester, signal generator and cap. tester. I picked up a 1940 RCA oscilloscope for $20 and a VTVM for $10 in 1959 or 1960 when the local WURLITZER plant closed its doors. they worked well and I just needed to buy new probes. When we moved to our present location in 1990 (a condo) I donated all of the test equipment to our local Good Will store.

Tom


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#21
February 3, 2011 at 16:32:27
We have Goodwill stores here too. Unfortunately, whether things you donate are bought by someone who actually benefits from it is random chance. Some things are just thrown away, or never appear in the stores.
They have stopped offering most computer related things here because they have problems getting someone to check them out and help price them. E.g. I used to be able to get really good deals on used CRT monitors and used better printers from there, but now they either toss 99% of computer related stuff into garbage bins, or they toss that in bins, and when they're full, they take them, or have them picked up, to be "recycled". Our city has an extensive "world class" waste recycling program - it's original purpose was to lengthen the time it took for a huge dump site to fill up by recycling some of the trash, but they now have a facility where they take apart and shred the computer related stuff and sort it into it's materials and sell that bulk to whoever will buy it, rather than actually recycling anything so that it can be used by someone as is again. You'd think that they could at least recycle the ram, cpus, and monitors. There is a province wide collection system of computer related stuff, and TVs, and other electronic stuff, but as in most places, once it's been submitted or thrown in the trash, you're not allowed officially to pick through it, although some smaller "dump" operators will let you do that.

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#22
February 3, 2011 at 19:10:26
We have a somewhat similar program in our area. Four times a year our County government sets up an electronic item recycling program at various locations throughout the county.You have to deliver your item to the site, but anything electronic is accepted, from old cell phones to console TV's. Everything is dumped on a big pile, supposedly to be shredded and recycled. I could not bear to see my old stuff end up that way, although it may have.

Tom


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