Fan running loud..

Sunon / Kd1209
September 17, 2009 at 17:31:50
Specs: Windows Vista
I removed the old case fan from my dead HP a6000n and installed it on the new ASUS CM5570 which only has 1 fan/heatsink attached to the MB. When I installed the old fan which used to be quiet on the HP to the new ASUS, it runs loud nonstop afterI turn the PC on.

Do anyone know why is this happening? The case fan was really quiet when I used my old HP.


Old PC Spec: Vista Home Premium 32-bit, 3GB ram, Radeon HD 2600XT 256MB, 300W PS, Dual Core 2.2Ghz 1M L2 Cache,
New PC Spec: Vista Home Premium 64-bit, 6GB ram, Onboard Graphic Intel GMA X4500, 300W PS, Dual Core 2.6Ghz 2M

Does it have anything to do with the specs? Fair comp knowledge here.. so help please


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#1
September 18, 2009 at 09:07:11
Are you sure it's the case fan you're hearing?
If your CPU fan connector has 4 wires, one of them controls the regulation of the load on the cpu and the speed of the cpu fan, but that feature may not be enabled by default because not all cpus support that. You may need to go into the bios Setup and turn that feature on.

"my dead HP a6000n "

What are/were your symptoms?
Usually when a computer won't work properly, the mboard and cpu are NOT what caused the problem.
Probably the most common reason a system won't boot properly is the PS is failing or has died.

Was the case fan connected to a fan header on the mboard on the a6000n, or to case wiring?

If it was connected to case wiring, there may be a temp regulated rpm controller in that wiring.

"...ASUS CM5570 which only has 1 fan/heatsink attached to the MB..."

Did you connect the case fan to a fan header on the mboard?
If so, which one? E.g. a header for a PS fan would not support temp regulation of the speed of the fan - that's done inside the PS, if applicable, not by the mboard.

The a6000n uses the OEM Asus M2N68-LA mboard.
According to the HP info for that mboard:
Motherboard Specifications, M2N68-LA (Narra)
http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/...
It has:
"Two 12v fan connectors for CPU fan and PC fan."

As usual for brand name builders, HP has no detailed info about what you see in the HP bios version bios Setup settings

Asus itself probably has no info about this mboard model, but it does have info about similar models - e.g. M2N68-AM SE .
You could take a look at a mboard manual for one on those to see if there is something in the description of the bios Setup settings, or elsewhere in the manual, that indicates the bios regulates the speed of a case fan according to temp. If HP's bios version for the a6000n / M2N68-LA is very similar to Asus's version, and the case fan's (PC fan) rpm was temp regulated, then it may not be temp regulated on the mboard for the ASUS CM5570 , if you have the case fan connected to a case fan header.
(A header for a PS fan would not support temp regulation of the speed of the fan - that's done inside the PS, if applicable, not by the mboard.)

On the other hand, why do think you need a case fan on the ASUS CM5570? Asus would have supplied one with the built system if the system needed it - it would be in their best interest to do so. If you're not going to be changing the cpu to one that generates more heat, you probably don't need a case fan - the cpu fan and power supply fan(s) can handle getting rid of the heat generated. .
Using a case fan when you don't need one just pulls more lint and dust into the case interior.

If you insist on using a case fan, if it can only run at it's full speed when connected to this mboard, get yourself another case fan that isn't as noisy - they cost as little as $10, or less.


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#2
September 18, 2009 at 11:33:39
I connect the fan to the chassis fan header on the motherboard. I just followed how it was connected to the HP. The reason I put a case fan in there is because I am installing a graphic card that I used on the HP, and the card gets quite hot after running for couple minutes. So I am assuming the fan would help but im not sure..

the a6000n died because I messed up the BIOS, i just followed the HP site steps and installed a BIOS to fix the vista sleep problems, but after I installed it, I got a Checksum error, my friend came and tried to fix it but he said the bios was flashed dead.

"" I went into the BIOS setup, and in the power option tab, there is a hardware monitor option, it lists *CPU Temperature, MB Temperature, CPU Fan Speed, VCORE Voltage, 3.3V, 5V, 12V, Smart Q-Fan Function* Should I change the settings on the CPU Fan Speed [RPM] or [Ignored]? or is it the other settings..

Thanks for the help bud.


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#3
September 18, 2009 at 14:27:36
You haven't answered some of the questions I asked.
.....

"I connect the fan to the chassis fan header on the motherboard. I just followed how it was connected to the HP."

Did you connect it to a 3 pin fan header on the mboard? How many of them are there? As I implied above, if you connect the case fan to one for PS (Power Supply) it will run full speed all the time because the mboard does not control it's speed.

"The reason I put a case fan in there is because I am installing a graphic card that I used on the HP, and the card gets quite hot after running for couple minutes. So I am assuming the fan would help but im not sure."

What video chipset does the video card have?

They always get hot, but if they're well designed they don't add much if any heat to the inside of the case - the power supply fan(s) usually easily get rid of the heated air they produce. .
......

You MAY need a power supply with more capacity!

Your power supply must have at least the minimum capacity required to support a system with the graphics card you are using installed, or the max graphics card you might install in the future.
(Onboard video - video built into the mboard - IS NOT A CARD!)
You can go to the video card maker's web site and look up the specs for the model - often under system requirements - the minimum PS wattage, and, more important, the minimum amperage the PS must supply at 12v is stated. If you don't find that, any card with the same video chipset including any letters after the model number has very similar minimum PS requirements.
Some power supplies have more than one +12v amperage rating - they have two - in that case you add the rated max amperages to determine the total +12v amperage rating.

If you needaPSwith more capacity, you can usually replace it with any decent standard sized standard ATX PS.

Standard (PS/2) power supply size - 86mm high, 150mm wide, 140mm deep, or 3 3/8" h x 5 7/8" w x 5 1/2" d , or very close to that, though the depth can be more or less for some PSs.

Don't buy an el-cheapo PS.
See response 3 in this:
http://www.computing.net/answers/ha...
.........

"I went into the BIOS setup, and in the power option tab, there is a hardware monitor option, it lists *CPU Temperature, MB Temperature, CPU Fan Speed, VCORE Voltage, 3.3V, 5V, 12V, Smart Q-Fan Function* Should I change the settings on the CPU Fan Speed [RPM] or [Ignored]? or is it the other settings.."

Those are mostly the current readings being detected my sensors built into the mboard - you can't change those.

The SmartQ Function might be the one that controls the load on the cpu and the corresponding cpu fan speed - if so, if you enable it, when your the bios senses your system doesn't need the full power of the cpu, the load on the cpu is decreased, the cpu fan tends to spin slower.

I know your Asus system model, but I have no idea which Asus mboard it has in it.
The Asus mboard manuals always have info about the settings in the bios Setup in them. They also often explain what the special features of the mboard are - in there somewhere you should be able to find out whether the speed of the case fan is temp controlled - I've never seen that in bios Setup settings, but I don't see many bioses of recent mboards, so it's possible it's there.

The model number of the mboard should be printed in obvious larger characters on the mboard's surface, often between the slots. If you search for the manual for that model on the Asus web sites, you should be able to download the manual and take a look at it.

I always have trouble accessing the Asus web sites (pages load SLOWLY) and today that's a lot worse than usual.
........

"the a6000n died because I messed up the BIOS, i just followed the HP site steps and installed a BIOS to fix the vista sleep problems, but after I installed it, I got a Checksum error, my friend came and tried to fix it but he said the bios was flashed dead."

I could go on and on about how dumb it is to flash the bios when you don't need to, but too late now.
NEVER flash you bios unless you find specific info such as in the notes where you get the bios update that mentions it fixes the exact problem you're having! Almost always, flashing the bios WILL NOT fix the problem you're having!
.......

It's NORMAL to get merely the "Cmos Checksum Error" or similar message after you have flashed the bios - you simply go into the bios Setup and load at least the date and time, and load bios defaults or optimized defaults if you have just flashed the bios (the flashing usually doesn't do that) , save bios settings, and the message won't appear after that.

If you a get "Cmos Checksum Error" or similar AND ALSO see something about the "Boot Block" , then you can probably try flashing the bios again, but you MUST do it by booting from a prepared floppy disk with the right files on it in a floppy drive connected to the mboard (that always works), or for more recent mboards you may be able to flash the bios by having the right files on a bootable USB flash drive (I don't know if that applies to the HP bios version but it applies to many recent Asus mboards with Asus bioses), or if you have the right files on a bootable CD (recent Asus mboard CDs will autoboot the computer and load a bios recovery program if they're in the drive while booting).

Most people don't have the knowledge to be able to recover from a flash that went wrong.
......

NOTE that you may see a message while booting when the monitor is connected to the onboard video, no video card is in a slot, but NOT when you connect a monitor to the video card in a slot.

If you see a message similar to "Cmos Checksum Error" AND
"Boot Block Bios loaded" or "Boot Block" anything, when you try booting the computer,
then your flash chip is probably not physically damaged, and you may be able to flash the bios again.
........

If you have or can borrow a floppy data cable and a floppy drive (and a floppy disk that has the right files on it) , you could attempt to flash the bios again.

You connect a floppy drive data cable to the floppy header on the mboard, and a floppy drive, the proper way, and a power connector to the floppy drive.

If you don't have those, or can't borrow those, they'll cost you less than $20 total when you buy them locally from places that have lots of computer parts, and they can come in handy in any case for any mboard that has a floppy data cable header (almost all desktop mboards have that including recent ones) for when you have a serious problem, even if the case doesn't have a bay for a floppy drive - cheap insurance.

Further info available from me, if you're interested..



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Related Solutions

#4
September 18, 2009 at 16:22:15
I just checked, there are 2 3 pin fan header on the motherboard next to the cpu fan. one says PS fan, another says Chas fan, I connected the fan into the Chas fan. Sorry forgot to mention, I'm installing a Radeon HD2600XT 256MB PCI Express x16 into the new comp. I thought the old comp which used to have 300W could handle it, so my new comp which also has 300W could also handle it.. maybe the more ram and hard disk spaces consumes more power.

Anyway, I will try to fix the old comp following the steps you've given me. I've also downloaded the asus m2n68 manual and there is a section inside that show users how to recover and flash the BIOS. I don't have a floppy drive, but it says a CDROM or a USB can also do it. I've gone thru the same process but I think I downloaded the wrong file and used the wrong flasher. I think I have to download the Afudos utility and the latest bios. I'll give it a try.

thanks for the help and your time.


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#5
September 18, 2009 at 16:54:26
If you use the Asus flash utility and/or the Asus bios updates, you may TRASH the bios when you use those with the HP bios version the bios had / has. There's no guarantee that will work, because HP (and Compaq) use oddball bios versions.

By the way, did you use an Asus bios version when you attempted to flash the bios, or a HP bios version? A HP bios update should have worked; there's no guarantee an Asus bios update will work with the HP bios.

AND on top of that, Asus has no support for the mboard model on the computer - it's an OEM only mboard - e.g. if the I/O chip alone is different, you cannot succssfully use the Asus bios updates!


"I'm installing a Radeon HD2600XT 256MB PCI Express x16 into the new comp."

I checked. It requires a minimum 400 watt PS capactity.
A 2600XT chipset requires more power than 2600Pro.


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#6
September 18, 2009 at 20:10:20
This is the ONLY proper update for the mboard:

M2N68-LA Motherboard BIOS Update
http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/...

File name:
sp37190.exe

......

From the Badflash site:

"If you have an IBM, HP, or any computer with a Non-AMI or AWARD BIOS (like Phoenix) contact me BEFORE you flash."

Email: jack@badflash.com

"These bios utilities do not provide a way to backup your old file. If you have a Bad Flash I may not be able to help you without one. You need to backup your existing bios image using UNIFLASH (see our FAQs page) so that you can get back if your update fails. I do not charge to backup or store your bios image. You would only be charged if you need it programmed back in. In some cases we may be able to located an AMI or AWARD file that will work in your machine and give you more features and support than the Phoenix image. "

"...there is a great program called UNIFLASH available at (link no longer valid) that can also be used to save the file. DO NOT attempt to use any of these to actually flash your chip, the PHLASH.EXE program must be used for that."

Uniflash 1.4 download and description
http://www.softpedia.com/get/Others...

"As a side note, UNIFLASH has a UI (user interface) so it definitely helps beginners. Execute the "uniflash.exe" and the UI will appear and guide you through."

Version 1.4 here too.
"supports a wide range of chipsets and Flash ROMs (read uniflash.txt for a list, it’s also included in the ZIP package). Since v1.40, UniFlash is licensed under GNU GPL v2."
http://www.rainbow-software.org/
................

To find out if it's possible to recover from your bad flash...

Look at your bios chip - is it in a socket and removable?
If it is, the badflash guy only charges $30 US including shipping to supply you with a new bios chip already flashed, if that's possible with your HP bios version.

http://www.badflash.com

1. email the badflash guy, Jack, at: jack@badflash.com

2. place this link in the email:

NOTE that the links in posts on this site that have dots at the right end won't work if you just copy it!
RIGHT click on it and choose Copy Shortcut - paste that in the email.

M2N68-LA Motherboard BIOS Update
http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/...

3. Ask him if it's possible to extract something you can use from that that can be used along with PHFLASH or UNIFLASH so you can attempt to recover from your bad flash.


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#7
September 19, 2009 at 12:33:35
That sp37190.exe file is the one that I used to try to fix the sleep problems. The bios is not in a socket, it is sealed in the MB with some pins and not removable. This is why my friend was not able to replace a new one for me. I will take a look at the link you gave me and follow the instructions. If it still can't be fixed, I think I might just buy a compatible motherboard to skip all the repairing. Thanks for your help though, I really appreciate it.

For the Asus CM5570, I found out the motherboard model for it, It is a P5QL-VM EPU, Socket 775.
This is the exact same model with spec (link is broken.. it worked a moment ago)

I read the manual and I couldn't find anything related to fan speed control, Here are the settings displayed on the Hardware monitor.

Chassic Fan Speed: 2700 RPM or Ignored
CPU Fan Speed: 324 RPM
CPU Fan Profile: Optimal Mode, (I changed it to silent mode but seems like that only affects CPU fan not others.)
CPU Q-Fan control: Enabled

Maybe I should get a new PS with 400w+, when the time I need to install the graphic card but that is no rush, I'll just stick with the onboard graphic for now. I got a Q, If I install a new PS, would the fan still run that loud and fast?

Edit: I found this article and it teaches how to control the fan speed by unplugging 2 wires from the fan and connect them to the power supply. My fan runs at about 1200 RPM now, which is pretty quiet. I didn't know there is such a trick :D
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/arti...


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#8
September 19, 2009 at 15:25:35
Have you tried emaing Jack at badflash? (see response 6)
....

"That sp37190.exe file is the one that I used to try to fix the sleep problems."

There are at least several things that can cause that, that don't require you to flash the bios. E.g. Often, that won't work correctly if the main chipset drivers have not been loaded after Setup was finished when you have installed Windows from a regular CD or DVD.
In any case, that's a Windows based bios update, and HP doesn't offer any other way of flashing the bios. If Windows is not working 100% normally when you run a Windows based bios update program, you can end up with something going wrong during the flashing attempt.
Most mboard makers still offer at least two ways you can update the bios - by using a Windows program, or by making a bootable floppy with the proper files on it (or sometimes a bootable CD) that you can use to boot the computer with - the latter is the safest way to flash the bios. Some more recent mboards are able to flash the bios by using a prgram built into the bios, if you provide the update file to flash it with. As I said before, at least some drivers CDs you get along with Asus mboards will auto boot the computer if they are in a drive while booting and load a program that allows you to try to recover from a failed flash attempt - you provide the update file to flash it with, or sometimes you can load a fail safe bios version that's on the CD.

"I think I might just buy a compatible motherboard to skip all the repairing"

I looked for a used HP mboard the same as yours but didn't find one.

Most but not all HP and Compaq mboard bioses, sometimes IBM/Lenovo's, sometimes Intel's (there are Intel made OEM mboards in many brand name systems that have a Phoenix based brand name bios version), those on some old mboards, use a Phoenix based bios version, and in most cases with more recent mboards that's a problem if a flash fails, because there is no version you can install on a bootable disk.
Asus doesn't offer away to update the bios using a bootable disk, but if the bios version is an AMI or Award one, you can make a bootable disk and use the proper AMI ort Award flash utility to flash the bios, or to recover from a failed flash by preparing the files a little differently.
Gigabyte certainly still offers a way to flash the bios by using a bootable disk. Most other mboard makers other than Intel and Asus do too.

"I read the manual and I couldn't find anything related to fan speed control"

As I said above, I've never seen that in a bios Setup, but it's possible it could be there in bioses for more recent mboards.
OR - it's possible the mboard on the old computer has wiring and circuits connected to the "PC Fan" header that regulate the speed of the case fan according to the temp inside the case, and in that case there doesn't need to be a setting in the bios Setup.

If the noises bothers you, get yourself a 3 wire case fan that makes less noise - look at it's ad or packaging and make sure it saysit produces less noise. In general, if you have a place to mount it on the case, a larger fan, e.g. 120mm, makes less noise than the 80mm fans, but the latter are usually cheaper. Make sure it has two ball bearings, or a better pair of somethin better (e.g. ceramic) - if it says ball bearing without the s, it's got one ball bearing, one sleeve bearing - sleeve bearings will NOT last as long.


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#9
September 19, 2009 at 16:46:02
I already email jack about the bad flash. Thanks for the help! It helped me a lot. I really want to get the a6000n back up alive so I can multi-tasking with 2 comps..


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