Dead Custom Built PC?

May 2, 2011 at 07:28:32
Specs: Windows XP, AMD,/1gig
Hi, I'm new here, but not to PC's.
I have a problem. Sons system, XP on a home built system. MB is a Winfast 6150BK8MC, CPU AMD 3800.
Son kept tell me that the system would just shut down and reboot for no reason, I could find no problem with it. RANDOM.
Then PC shuts down and this time does not restart. PSU working fine, volts where they should be. BUT DEAD. CPU stone cold.
So, I find another MB, again, WINFAST, 6100K8MA with an AMD 3200. Same problem, PSU fine, system dead, cold CPU. Swapped CPU's made no difference.
Has anybody got any ideas?
Cheers Guys

See More: Dead Custom Built PC?

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 08:04:27
The power supply may be giving the right volts when tested but the amps may be dropping when under load.

Things to try.
Disconnect the power to cdroms and A:drive (make sure computer is unplugged first) If it does not keep rebooting the power supply amps are dropping under load

Run an anti virus program looking for the blaster virus.

Borrow and try a different power supply.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 08:05:23
Defective power supply would be my guess. Just because you get correct voltages when testing doesn't mean they will hold under load.

What is the brand and model of the power supply?

Are you running integrated graphics or add in?

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 08:14:35
Hi thanks for getting back to me.
PSU is 'HERCULES 400W' PX400, 400 watts.
That was my original theory, low on AMPS.

integrated graphics.

At present, PSU is ON, But that's all. HDD, CDROM, FDD, all disconnected. Only thing to power are the MB, CPU, RAM, leaving on and feeling CPU, no heat felt, over 3 minutes.


Report •

Related Solutions

May 2, 2011 at 08:28:32
I didn't find specs on that particular power supply but did find a listing for a Hercules 400W for $12.99. That puts that unit in the junk column.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 08:39:39
Just found one on ebay for £2.97 + £28.15 P&P.
No thanks, I'll find one closer to home. If that is the problem. Will need to prove first.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 09:18:02
Hi, I have just swapped out my systems PSU, A 'ROHS ATX450 Watts.
Still the same. Both CPU, MB dead.

System does not beep. even though, Memory, Monitor, missing. So no IBM Codes
All of MB stone cold to touch.

Any ideas Guys?

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 09:21:09
You have to put at least one stick of memory in. If i understand you correctly, you didn't have any installed.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 09:22:43
"PSU is 'HERCULES 400W' PX400, 400 watts"

Absolute garbage. Even at $13 it's overpriced. I've seen these exact units before. They're extremely lightweight (which indicates cheap internal components) & the specs are horrible. 11A on the +12v rail isn't nearly enough for a modern system. Look for proof all you want, but there's no doubt in my mind where the problem lies:

Are you benchtesting?

BTW, weight is the poor man's way to check for quality. A decent quality PSU should weigh roughly as much as a 2L bottle of soda (full). Do either of these PSUs even come close to that? I know the Hercules doesn't.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 09:24:50
Never know that one before. No memory, then I should at least get some beeps.
I do not think it's even getting to that stage, of seeing a graphics BIOS, let alone Memory.
Something tells me, the Main chips are just not getting anything, but why???
OK, I have now tried them with memory, but I get the same answer. Zippo.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 09:27:46
Take the board out of the case & benchtest it!

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 09:45:43
OK, the 6150BK8MC, DEAD, but not to sure if I have the link on the pins. Fitted the same way as I did on the 6100K8MA, which fires up, then shuts down. within 2 seconds.

That is out of the case on a rubber mat with PSU attached. and linking pins 8 & 9.
Not having a user Manuel for either is a pain.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 09:55:19
Mickliq, that link you posted, goes nowhere. Most build it yourself cases, the PSU's are garbage. But seeing as this HERCULES has worked for the past X years, it has not done to bad. I do not think it's the PSU. What it's was driving:- MB+CPU+Memory, 2 x HDD, 1x FDD, 1 x CDROM. Which is about std. and not drawing much from it.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 10:07:20
MICKLIQ, would this PSU be any good?
Ezcool 500w psu
Silent fan technology
24 & 20 Pin Ready
Meets Intel v2.03 enhanced +12V
Over-voltage and current protection +3.3V;+5V;+12V
100% Burn in and hipot tested; short circuit protection
EMI Filter built in
For 775; AM2 and all backward compatible CPU's
White boxed CE/ FCC/ UL approved
ROHS Compliant

PSU Ratings:
+12V 34A
+3.3V 28A
+5V 30A
-5V 0.3A
-12V 0.8A
+5VSB 3.0A

Connectors Included:
1 x 24 & 20 Pin Main Power
1 x 4 pins Main Power
2 x HDD/CD-ROM Power
1 x FDD Power
2 x Serial ATA

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 10:27:57
Does the case in use use screw in metal standoffs to mount the motherboard or just some raised bosses instead?

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 10:53:21
8 screwed in brass

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 11:00:14
OK then. One possibility is that a standoff is installed in the wrong position. Standoffs should only be installed under a screw hole and should be under every screw hole.

Bench testing the motherboard takes things like that out of the equation.

Did you apply a new small amount of thermal compound between the CPU and heat sink? Did you connect the square 4 pin auxiliary power connector to the board?

BTW, I wasn't providing a link for you to buy that power supply. I was pointing out that because that brand is so cheap that I know it is junk.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 11:11:41
I did not even fit the heat sink, that's how I know it's not getting hot. STONE cold, fitting the HS would have made no difference to it's temp.
Stand OFF are all present and correct. where they should be.
The BTW bit, I know, but it could have been a good read.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 11:17:38
I just checked the link I posted & it worked fine for me.

I'm not going to get into a huge debate about power supplies. Hercules PSUs are garbage & 11A on the +12v isn't enough for your needs. I don't know which 3800+ you have, but if it's the 89W version, it requires at least 7.5A from the +12v on it's own. Each HDD or optical drive requires at least 1.0A & each fan requires about 0.25A. Add em up & the +12v rail is maxed out.

For your reading pleasure:

And no, EZCool is NOT a good brand.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 11:22:06
"I did not even fit the heat sink"

And you're an experienced builder? Although most modern CPUs have built-in thermal protection circuitry, powering up a CPU with no HSF installed is just asking for trouble. Prior to the A64 & P4, the CPU would have fried instantly if you had done that.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 12:25:47
I do not recall saying that I was an experienced builder.
The last PC I built was in 1989. Times have changed, that's why I'm on here asking for some advice..
So, Ezcool are a no go then. What do you recommend?

Before I even started to do all this testing, The systems were dead, zippo, before I lifted the fan. So, fan or no fan, Dead.
It's as though there is no voltage getting through to the MB, let alone to all the components. But, you get all voltages where the should be. So, maybe the CPU is a gonna, but both is the puzzle?

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 12:30:13
On the bench with memory, fan, CPU on 6100K8MA. She fires up, then shuts down within 2 seconds.
The same process with 6150BK8MC, nothing. But that could be down to a link.
Anybody know where I can find an on- line UM for these MB?

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 12:47:18
I now have four psu's here that all have proper voltages and are all bad. I need to throw them out. I keep saying I'll strip them for parts but I just end up replacing the psu when I run into a bad one. Count on spending at least $60 american for a psu. Just my opinion but it seems to me any less than that and quality starts dropping in a big way by the dollar.

I would look at something like This



Report •

May 2, 2011 at 13:06:59
Thanks for the link, but all I get is 'File Not Found'
As for PSU, I agree, it's worth buy a good one, and $60, £45 is OK.
Now I have tried 3 PSU's, the one that I started out with. and two others, that I know work, and are work OK as I type. So, I'm not to sure that I have a PSU problem here.

There must be something else, or the two workers, would have worked on both the MB and CPU's

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 13:21:23
In response to #19 above. You stated in #1 "So, I find another MB, again, WINFAST, 6100K8MA with an AMD 3200". So, did you buy a board with the CPU already mounted? Does it have a heat sink/fan on it too? If you don't have a working fan connected to the CPU fan header on the motherboard the computer is not going to POST.

Going back to the original board/CPU. When you opened the case up was there lots of dust/dirt in there? If so, did you clean it up with a vacuum cleaner? Vacuum cleaner can kill computer components via ElectroStatic Discharge.

Now on to the replacement board/CPU. Do you know for a fact this was a working board?

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 14:19:53
>>In response to #19 above. You stated in #1 "So, I find another MB, again, WINFAST, 6100K8MA with an AMD 3200". So, did you buy a board with the CPU already mounted? Does it have a heat sink/fan on it too? If you don't have a working fan connected to the CPU fan header on the motherboard the computer is not going to POST.<<
The MB + CPU was given to me as, and I quote, 'Working' Which it does try to do.
Yes to the CPU, No to the fan, but I did connect the fan from the system when I first tried it. Boot, shut down after a few seconds.

>>Going back to the original board/CPU. When you opened the case up was there lots of dust/dirt in there? If so, did you clean it up with a vacuum cleaner? Vacuum cleaner can kill computer components via ElectroStatic Discharge.<<
Dust was minimal, hardly any, and no Dyson or even a vacuum cleaner was used.

>>Now on to the replacement board/CPU. Do you know for a fact this was a working board?<< Unknown.
To recap. Sons system kept shutting down randomly, then stops, will not boot, to POST.
2nd MB with CPU tried with same setup as sons, ie, Fan, HDD Memory. again, will not boot to POST.

I have tried different combos, of MB, CPU, with Fan, without Fan, with memory, without memory.
Always the same, Sons board will not power up. Nothing, not even fan. That's why I say, it could be me with the power on pin being wrong.
Given board, powers on, but not reaching post, fan working.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 14:28:49
Pull the board out of the case. Test on the bench with ONLY the following hardware connected. Power supply to motherboard twice. 20/24 connector & square 4 pin connector. CPU/ HS/Fan, 1 stick of RAM in slot #1, on board video or add in card, monitor, keyboard. Nothing else connected.

Start the board by momentarily shorting out the two power pins on the motherboard with a screw driver. Board should POST to a screen that says no system disk or similar.

If the board then POSTs add in the remaining RAM and try again. Then add the hard drive and try again. Get the idea?

You must have a very small amount of thermal paste applied to the center of the CPU before installing the heat sink. Take care to install correctly. There is a step in the heat sink that must correspond with the step on the board.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 14:39:12
No problem. ONLY, I have done all the above. With same results as above.
At present. Both boards are out of case and on a rubber mat.
Sons with CPU, HS/FAN and the 1gig of ram, IG graphics card connected to monitor. Pins 6&8 power are linked. Nothing happens.
Doing the same with given MB, as above. system fires up, fan spins, then system shuts down.
None of the boards reach POST. On does not even fire up the fan. putting an MM across red / Blk, 0v

I'm beginning to think that both MB's and CPU are dead. Time to go and find a bundle.

Thanks for your time guys. I think we have come to a dead end.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 15:01:06
You only make momentary contact with the start button pins. Do not wire together.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 15:08:32
I don't have time right now to look but memory serves me that you may be connecting the wrong pins for the start button. Check the manual. You can download one for Foxxconn winfast. Check the link below.

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 15:21:26
Kind of hard to follow with all these posts but it seems to me the common denominator is both boards were initially connected to the original power supply. IF that power supply was bad and ruined the first board then it very likely ruined the second motherboard as well.

Ding dong the witch is dead. . . .

Report •

May 2, 2011 at 23:11:56
1. Why did sons PC keep shutting down for no reason? Did not reboot, just shut down.
2. Bad PSU, in what way could a PSU be bad?
3. If power on pins are left connected, what's the out come/
4. As said, common denominator is PSU, but could that kill a MB?
5. The 4 pin 2 yellow, 2 blk, I take it that this is some sort of monitoring connection? 12v on each pair of BLK/Yellow.
6. Sons board is completely dead. NOTHING, no Voltage at all anywhere on it?
7. What would stop the 2nd board from POSTING. Starts up, then shuts down with a second or 2?

Thanks for the link above, but the link to the Motherboard Manual is dead.


Report •

May 2, 2011 at 23:15:07
PS, on both MB, it says, pins 6 & 8 power on.

Report •

May 3, 2011 at 01:03:55
2) A PSU has to provide several different voltages at sufficient current. If it fails to do that it's bad.

3) You mean if you jumpered the power switch pins? Not sure, it'd be the same as holding down the power switch on a working system. I suppose the system would power up and then shut off after 4 seconds.

4) Yes. Maybe a third of the time a PSU will fail in such a way that it ruins the motherboard as well.

5) They provide additional current at 12 volts for the cpu.

6) You might check the fuse inside the PSU. But replacing the fuse doesn't necessarily mean you fixed it. The fuse may have blown because the PSU is bad.

7) Common behavior where the motherboard, PSU or both are bad.

Ding dong the witch is dead. . . .

Report •

May 3, 2011 at 01:11:32
1. Shut downs can be caused by both hardware and/or software issues. No reboot is not necessarily an indication of a hardware failure but could be.

2. Power supplies are both transformers and rectifiers with capacitors to supply the needed boost at start up. Capacitors wear out for one thing. Circuits can fail. I can't answer more succinctly than that because I am not an electrical engineer. Suffice to say that as helpers here we KNOW they can be defective and still show some signs of life.

3. If power pins are left connected the computer may try to start but will shut down. Holding in the power button for 3 seconds is one method to shutdown an ATX computer. I don't know if longer than that would damage something or not.

4. Power supplies can fail in many ways. The usual way for them to take out a motherboard is with a voltage spike/surge when they die. In your case the issue could have been something else.

5. The square 4 pin power connector that plugs into the board directly by itself is to feed +12V to the CPU. That is kind of a more direct method of delivering sufficient current to the CPU.

6. You can't test every trace on a motherboard. They are at least 4 layers thick with traces buried between insulators. Power supplies and boards work in harmony to allow some points on the board to have power even when shut down. This is done so you can remotely wake a system or place it in partial or full suspension. There are three main voltages supplied to the motherboard by the power supply. +12VDC, +5VDC, +3.3VDC. Then the circuitry on the board itself steps the voltage to the CPU core and the memory down even further. Those voltages vary with the CPU family. You are trying to wrap your head around something that is too complicated for me for sure and most likely for most of us here at CN.

7. Lots of reasons for failure to POST. One main one is sensors failing to sense CPU fan rotating fast enough if at all. Another is temperature sensors peaking out. That can be from firing up without any heat sink, for instance. Or the power supply can deliver sufficient current on any of the rails (12V is the most likely) after the kick start from the capacitors.

To sum it up various circuits require various voltages at continuous wattage. If that doesn't happen things stop.

The link in #29 works for me. That said, it was only posted for reference sake on the power pins. You seem to have verified which are the power pins so it is of no particular use as it is for another series of AMD boards.

Report •

May 3, 2011 at 02:18:41
I think it's time to goto #27 line #12.

I'm watching a few bundles on ebay, not to sure what I want though.
Could do with some advice on PSU's to buy, what are the good makes?

Cheers and thanks to all for your input.

Report •

May 3, 2011 at 05:55:46
Well, my advice would be to not buy computer hardware from ebay, but that is just me.

There has to be some good local shops and online vendors that ship to the UK.

Report •

May 4, 2011 at 07:14:51
Just been testing the PSU, as this - 4th block down. All looks to be good, and doing test, HDD & PSU stay up. BUT.
When the 4 pin, 2 x yellow, 2 x black is connected. System is dead.
What would that suggest?

Report •

May 4, 2011 at 07:40:21
As was stated above, voltages at load need to be within specs. If the board is not POSTing then the power supply is not under load.

What hardware are you now testing? You introduced 3 power supplies and two motherboards.

On thing that hasn't been suggested you could try. With nothing connected to the motherboard, clear the CMOS by moving the clrcmos jumper from the 1/2 position to the 2/3 position and back again. Try POSTing again.

Report •

May 4, 2011 at 09:50:28
As #37. Just picked up another 'VERY OLD' PC. All works.
Only a 110W PSU, but a working system non the less. Swapped PSU's around. The one from above works the PC I just picked up. The PSU I just picked up, does the same as has been read above, apart from one thing, Sons PC now runs, but again, on both MB, No POSTING. Just done the CMOS clear, but no change.
Once thing I've noticed with these winfast motherboards, connector on the motherboards is 24pin as opposed to the cable coming out of the PSU which is 20 with an adaptor cable in-between. Is this normal?

Report •

May 4, 2011 at 10:13:07
24 pin ATX power connectors added the 4 pins. Are you sure at least one of your power supplies doesn't have a 20 + 4 connector. The connector looks just like the 4 pin that we discussed above. The difference is it can slide together with the 20 pin to form the 24 pin. Not absolutely necessary. Depends on things like the wattage draw of the CPU and the add in graphics card, if present.

I don't know about any adapter cable. Is that adapter connecting a molex connector like you use to connect power to a hard drive to the socket?

If you have older power supplies that don't have the required connectors they may not have the required wattage on the various voltage rails. Older motherboards utilized 5V more than they now do. 12V has supplanted 5V in many cases. So even if a PSU is rated at say 400W the 12V rail may be inadequate.

110W power supply isn't going to fire up either of the Athlon boards.

How are you now testing? On the bench with minimal hardware as described above? Be sure to have the CPU fan connected to the header marked as CPU fan.

Report •

May 4, 2011 at 10:34:19
Going on what I have read. The system I have just picked up, is an old one. The 4 pin Y/B cable is there from the PSU bat cable tied up out of the way. No skt on MB for it.
The Main cable bunch is 20 pin.
Now, the Winfast MB's have a 4 pin Skt for the Y/B cables. They also have a 24 pin plug. Cable from PSU is 20 Skt.
Now for the Adaptor cable. One end is 20 pin plug, the other is 24 pin Skt.
working from 20 pin. to the 24 way. pin 2 orange pair to pins 2 & 12. - pin 10 yellow pair to pins 10 & 11. - pin 11 red pair to pins 14 & 15. All others single.

Looking at the two PSU's the one I have just picked up and the one in question.are the same, apart from the one I just picked up has no white. Pin 13, no pin either, blank hole.

Report •

May 4, 2011 at 12:52:45
Again, How are you now testing? On the bench with minimal hardware as described above? Be sure to have the CPU fan connected to the header marked as CPU fan.

If you are doing this and the CPU fan is running then the board is no totally dead as you stated above somewhere.

It is important when diagnosing hardware that you maintain consistent tests. That is why I am asking what I am.

All that is needed to POST are the items I listed in #26. Your board should have a device to create an audible beep code as necessary. Proper POST should generate 1 short beep. If you remove all the RAM you should hear an audible code.

Hearing no codes at all but seeing some activity MAY indicate there is not enough power to initialize the board. Are you momentarily shorting out pins 6&8 with a screw drivers?

Report •

May 4, 2011 at 15:00:58
That the one thing that is doing my head in. NO IBM Beeps. Started testing in case. Moved to bench, moved back to case.
PSU, MB, HS/FAn, CPU, That's it, no RAM, HDD, FDD, CDROM etc.
NO BEEPS. Fan spins up.
A 110 Watt PSU should be able to work MB, HS/FAn, CPU. Feeling around the board. All dead cold. There are two small HS over two small chips, whis should get some heat when power is feed through them. But Cold as metal is cold.
Leaving the Yellow/Black cable off. Fitting this cable, the system will not fire up. Dead.
I'm still convinced that these MD are no more, had it. But, I'm not convinced that the PSU is OK. But both the PSU's I have, the 110W and the 400W + the 500W in the system I'm writing this on, all work this system. OK, with the 110W, I did however remove all but one drive and all DVD-ROMS. No FDD any way.
But something tells me that the 400W PSU is flaky.
Poat #1, I said the the PC would shut down for no reason, when it felt like it. Reboot and she is fine for 24 hours or so, then shuts down again. Did this about 6 times over 7 days. Then gave up completely, and has not worked since.
I have bought a new MB with CPU, Ram just waiting for it to arrive. But, wanted to be 100% sure, that this PSU will not damage it. All the teats I have done, say that the PSU is fine. Below is how I carried out the test:-
To test an ATX PSU:

First, disconnect everything from the power supply (including MB.) Plug
AC cord into the rear of the PS. IF the PS has its own rocker on/off
switch, turn it ON. There should be +5v on pin 9 of the 20 pin connector
(+5vsb, usually a violet wire.) There should be >0.8v on pin 14 (PS-ON,
usually a green wire.) This is from an internal pull-up to the +5vsb.

Connect PS power leads to 1 or 2 IDE HDs (for a load). Jumper pin 14
(PS-ON) to pin 13 (ground, black wire.) At this point, fan in PS should
start spinning, drives should spin, and + 5/12v, -5/12v, +3.3v, and
+5vsb should be present at 20 pin connector.

Disconnecting pin 14-13 jumper should turn supply back off.


When your system fails to start, what is the voltage on pin 9? If it is
less than 4.75v, either a) the logic on your motherboard is shorting
b) your +5vsb is under powered, or c) your PS is bad. It is
most likely a combination of b) and c).

If your +5vsb is OK, measure pin 14 of the PS/MB connector. If it is <0.8v
(and the +5vsb is OK), the power supply should be on. If pin 14 is <0.8v,
the +5vsb is OK, and the PS is OFF, the PS is bad. If pin 14 is >2.0v, the
power supply is being told to stay OFF by the MB. If depressing the front
panel ON/OFF switch does NOT lower pin 14 to <0.8v (and the +5vsb is OK),
then the problem is NOT the power supply, but rather MB related.

I would go out tomorrow and buy a new PSU, But not knowing why this has happened is a pain. I must say thanks Otherhill for you time here. BTW, whats your name? Cheers, Andy

Report •

May 4, 2011 at 15:03:21
PS, the one thing I would love to do, is get AMP readings across all Voltages as I press the start button. But I cannot find anything that would guide me on that trip. One finding volts, another AMPS.

Report •

May 4, 2011 at 15:19:32
110W is NOT enough power to run the system as setup. No where near enough. Remember the Wattage is split between 3 rails. You need 89W on the 12V rail just to run the processor. Then the board and fans need some more. Then the graphics are probably at least another 5A @12V. You are talking about a minimum of 14 or 15Amps @12V. Look at the link below to see the power requirements of that CPU.

If you are going to continue to fiddle with computers you need to spend some cash and buy a decent power supply. I know you are in the UK but I am linking to some units for reference. Corsair has been voted the best brand a couple of times.

You can buy something that will only be good enough for what you are currently messing with or the safe bet would be to buy something with enough power to run a modern system with a decent Graphics card.

I recommend a PSU with a SINGLE 12V rail with at least 34/40A on that rail. The others will take care of themselves. Stay away from units with multiple 12V rails.

Report •

May 4, 2011 at 15:31:22
The CORSAIR 500W I can pick up for around £50 around $84. Which is OTT. by about £15 compared to Egg. I'm talking to them now to see if they ship to the UK.

Report •

May 4, 2011 at 15:32:51
And their reply.
23:30:35 : Kelly: I would be glad to assist you with that.
We do not ship to UK. Presently Newegg only ships orders within the United States and Puerto Rico, APO/FPO and Canada. Unfortunately, we cannot make any exceptions under any circumstances because our internal system is not set-up to accommodate international orders at this time.

Report •

May 4, 2011 at 15:55:08
I told you the link was for reference only. You can shop elsewhere for a PSU online. Corsair is not the only brand that is good. The link below is from a Google search. There are numerous online vendors mentioned in that thread. Shop and if you like the shop then go to the link below and check out their rating before ordering.

Report •

May 11, 2011 at 00:50:03
Hi all, I'm back with an update.
I have installed a new MB, well SH. Same type ZIF skt, 939, same CPU, PSU, Memory, HS/FAN. System has now been running for the past 5 days, 24/7, No problems so far. (Now that I have written this, it will no doubt catch fire, Sods Law and all that).
Thanks for all that have written with advice. Cheers and always remember to take time out for FUN, that's a minimum of 24 hours a day. ;-)

Report •

May 11, 2011 at 01:21:13
Basically you have built a new computer. At least you have it up and running. Thank you for letting us know the outcome.


Report •

Ask Question