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XP duel boot - second HD not found

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Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 07:27:08 Pacific
OS: XP Pro
CPU/Ram: Athlon xp 2200/500
Comment:

I have installed XP Pro as a duel boot (same OS), because the original installation (after 3 years) is now crawling.

Everything is working fine, except my second hard drive (which is working 100% in the original XP), is not accessible by the new XP install.

I've tried diskmgmt, and it sees the half the drive, but thinks it is unformatted. How can I get the drive recognized without formatting?

Thx
Joe



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Response Number 1
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 07:37:15 Pacific
Reply:

Is your WinXP CD the original version without any service packs integrated into the CD?

What sizes and interface (IDE/ SATA) are the two harddrives?


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Response Number 2
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 07:46:19 Pacific
Reply:

The original install was upgraded to SP2, the new install is from the CD without any service packs.

Drive 1: 80 GB
Drive 2: 300 GB


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Response Number 3
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 07:47:43 Pacific
Reply:

Interface: IDE


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Response Number 4
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 08:00:51 Pacific
Reply:

WinXP original is not 48bit LBA compliant. That means it can't work with drives larger than 127GB. Look at the link below for additional info on this topic.

In addition to the OS needing to be 48bit compliant your MBoard BIOS must also be 48bit LBA compliant.

Watch the POST screens at startup to verify all drives are properly identified by model. If they are then your only issue is the version of XP. SP1 makes the OS 48 bit compliant.

Problems can arise if installing the original XP to a drive/ partition larger than 127GB which can result in data corruption.

It isn't perfectly clear which drive was used to install the first installation of XP. Was that the 80GB?

http://www.48bitlba.com/index.htm


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Response Number 5
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 08:11:23 Pacific
Reply:

Yes the original was on the 80Gb. The problem is probably with the XP SP1, because it only sees the 300 Gb drive as 128 GB.

So I'm guessing I can either partition the 300Gb drive into pieces < 127 gb (with something ike Partition Magic), or upgrade SP1 to SP2... correct?

Thanks for all your help!


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Response Number 6
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 08:16:08 Pacific
Reply:

"because it only sees the 300 Gb drive as 128 GB". What only sees 128GB? The POST screens? That is where I instructed you look.


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Response Number 7
Name: wanderer
Date: August 7, 2007 at 08:19:55 Pacific
Reply:

Even with drive recognition in the original xp install, that won't make for a multiboot.

Review my past responses on multiboots to get this actually working.

Imagine the power if you knew how to internet search


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Response Number 8
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 08:33:57 Pacific
Reply:

joebann

wanderer's response above is true but is another issue beside the more pressing issue of 48bit LBA compliance. Post back stating wheather or not the two harddrives are identified by model number on the screen when you start up the computer.


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Response Number 9
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 09:06:51 Pacific
Reply:

OtheHill: Sorry, yes, on the post screen, both the drives are stated correctly by model.

And the second drive is actually 320 GB.

It was under disk management in XP where the 320 GB drive was showing up as 128 GB.


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Response Number 10
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 09:50:25 Pacific
Reply:

All that is needed is to install SP2 and Enable large disk support if needed.

Do you need to dual boot both of these XP installs?

If so, follow wanderer's thread or go to Microsoft Knowledge base and search that term.


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Response Number 11
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 09:58:43 Pacific
Reply:

No, I don't need dual boots. I only did it because the original install was getting extremely slow, and I wanted to see if it was the system or the drive.

Now that the new install is running so well, I'd like to eventually get rid of the original install, and only reload the handful of programs I use regularly.

Are there any actual ways of "cleaning out" the original install to get it running like new? I've seen many registry cleaners, but don't know if these are worth the couple of bucks they sell for.

I've tried to search for "multiboot wanderer", and come across many posts with his responses to multiboot, was there a specific thread I should be looking at?

Thanks again to both of you for your help.


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Response Number 12
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 10:12:15 Pacific
Reply:

If you don't want to multiboot then don't bother with it.

To cleanup your original installation you can download and run CCleaner, Adaware SE or 2007, Spybot search & destroy 1.4. Update these utilities before running.

Go to Internet Explorer and select Tools> Internet options> delete files and cookies.
Under settings set the amount of space to 1MB and set days to keep at 0 or 1 day. Clear history. Do that prior to running the other utilities.

Be aware that deleting the files and cookies will delete all your sign ins for various sites you visit and for your mail.

Temporarily Disable system restore then empty the recycle bin.

After you are done if the system seems OK then Enable system restore and set a restore point. If not download an AV program and search for viruses, trojans, etc.

As far as Registry cleaners go you normally shouldn't need any. If you feel the need repost here and ask for recommendations for free ones. Same goes for AV. You are using a firewall aren't you?



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Response Number 13
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 14:16:39 Pacific
Reply:

I went to try to use CCleaner on the original install, but now the 320GB drive is no longer recognized there either. It says it needs to be formatted.

The only thing I can think of altering when I was in the new install was in disk management, "marking the partition as active" for the second drive that was not active at the time, to see if that would enable that drive. (That obvioulsy was not right.)

Is there any way of making the drive readible on any of the installs?

Thanks again for your time and help.


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Response Number 14
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 14:38:23 Pacific
Reply:

What copy of XP were you in when you downloaded and ran CCleaner?
Did you install SP2 to the second installation. Don't do anything more to the original drive right now. Explain in detail what you did do.


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Response Number 15
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 14:47:44 Pacific
Reply:

Even before I ran CCleaner I switched back to the first installation (SP2) that needed to be cleaned, and the second drive was unreadable. I'm thinking it was from the change I made in the disk management in the second installation. That's all I did.

SP2 was not added to the second installation, because IF I could get the first installation running as fast as new, then I wouldn't need it. I've only been using the second installation because I couldn't even surf with the first.



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Response Number 16
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 14:56:35 Pacific
Reply:

Is the second drive even connected now? I suggest continuing with the cleanup of the first drive. I suggest disconnecting the other drive while doing that. Be sure the PSU is switched off or the computer is unplugged. Take proper static precautions.

If the second WinXP installation is needed you can get it fixed. Don't worry about it at the moment.


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Response Number 17
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 15:03:19 Pacific
Reply:

I can disconnect the second drive (320 GB)and do the clean as suggested on the first. Only data (no system files) are on this drive (hopefully it's all still there.)

Just for clarification the second install is on another partition of the 80 GB (first drive).

One point: The second installation is running great. All I need is access to the second drive and I would be more than happy. If this is irrelevant at this point, I will proceed as suggested.


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Response Number 18
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 15:08:27 Pacific
Reply:

Well, I was under the impression the second installation of XP was on the second drive.

Then there is no need to disconnect the 320GB drive. Eventually you may need to take ownership of the 320GB. When did you start using the 320GB? While in the OLD XP install or the NEW?


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Response Number 19
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 15:43:14 Pacific
Reply:

The HD was installed under the old.

Everything was working fine under the old, it just kept getting slower and slower. I tried defrag, adaware, virus checking, removing programs, and it just kept performing poorly. I figured it was overrun with too much junk, so I figured a new install would be the way to go.


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Response Number 20
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 15:47:23 Pacific
Reply:

Well, try what I suggested and see how it runs. You probably need to defrag too.


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Response Number 21
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 16:15:42 Pacific
Reply:

Ok, I've done the cleaning, but still only a marginal improvement. Plus for some reason, now it's not even connecting to the router any more. I'm using another computer to get this message out.

At this point, do you have any suggestions on how to get the second drive back?

Thanks


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Response Number 22
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 16:33:18 Pacific
Reply:

I missed the "issues" section in CCleaner, and after running that the system is much better. Not as good as new, but much better than before.

Now I just need to figure out why it's not getting a network address.

And how to get the second drive back.



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Response Number 23
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 18:19:53 Pacific
Reply:

joe

I was gone for awile as my internet and TV went out.

Try using the wizard for the internet.
If you are still in the XP with SP2 then go to disk management and see if the 320GB shows up there. If so, you need to take ownership. Look at the link below to find out how. http://support.microsoft.com/kb/308421


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Response Number 24
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 18:35:02 Pacific
Reply:

The 320GB shows up, but its allocated in 128GB and 170GB, while before I had it allocated as 80GB and 240GB.

Anyway, I went to try to take ownership, but there are no "security" tabs on that folder.

Plus I'm a bit concerned because in the properties of the 320GB drive it says "file system: RAW", shouldn't that be NTFS?

Sorry if I'm missing something.


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Response Number 25
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 18:47:46 Pacific
Reply:

You aren't missing anything but you did nothing tonight that should have affected that drive. It sounds like you DON'T have SP2 installed.
Right click My Computer and look at the service pack.


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Response Number 26
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 19:39:20 Pacific
Reply:

SP2 is installed on the original setup, and it isn't reading the drive there. That's what I'm worried about.

Right clicking on My Computer confirms SP2 is installed.


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Response Number 27
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 19:47:48 Pacific
Reply:

This all happened after you ran CCleaner on the partition you are currently using? You say you had the drive allocated as 80GB & 240GB? That can't be because a 320GB drive will only format out to 298GB, which is what it is now saying.

Did you install the 320GB before you upgraded to any service packs? I suggest you not do anything to the 320GB for the moment.

Lets go back to the installation you are now using. You say it is better? Did you get the internet working?


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Response Number 28
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 20:04:19 Pacific
Reply:

Actually I allocated 80GB (because I have an external that is 80, which I use for backup) and the remainder (which I just subtracted, but you are probably correct, it is not a full 240).

320GB was installed after SP2.

It is better than before, but nothing close to the new install.

Internet is now working... don't know exactly why. Or why it stopped in the first place.


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Response Number 29
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 20:09:14 Pacific
Reply:

OK, I can't explain what happened to the 320GB drive. Unless I missed something you did nothing to cause the partitions to change. I am wondering if you are correct about how you partitioned the drive. Had you formatted both partitions? How did you create the second partition? Primary or Extended?

How much data are we talking about here?
Have you any knowledge of Knoppix live CD?


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Response Number 30
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 20:15:39 Pacific
Reply:

I am fairly sure about the partition sizes.

I really think that when I went to the new install and in disk management set the second hard drive to "active" this did something. Are you sure that wouldn't affect anything? That's the only thing I did there. Is there anyway of setting it back to not active?

Both partitions were formatted, though I'm not sure whether it ws primary or extended.

Never heard of Knoppix live CD.

Thanks again for your time.


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Response Number 31
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 20:34:10 Pacific
Reply:

If you did that while in the second WinXP installation that didn't have any service packs installed I guess you could have reset the partitions at that time. Either way you need to attempt recovery before messing with the drive any more.

You didn't say how much data you thought is on the 320GB.

Knoppix is a live version of Linux that boots and runs from the CD. Linux can sometimes access files on a Windows drive even after the file system has been corrupted. Knoppix can be downloaded for free but it is a huge download. 700MB.

After downloading you install the program to a CDR. Then you boot to the CD and Knoppix will need to install some needed files to your machine in order to access the hardware. You would install to the WinXP sp2 drive. Hopefully you will be able to see and copy all the data files.

Depending on how much data you could copy to the D: drive, burn to CD/ DVD or a an External HDrive. Can even access your LAN, if you have one.

I suggest you download Knoppix, assumming you have a broadband internet connection.


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Response Number 32
Name: joebann
Date: August 7, 2007 at 20:42:20 Pacific
Reply:

I'm downloading Knoppix right now. So I'll have it by the time I wake up (this self-created problem has been driving me nuts)...

On the 320, fortunately I've backed up the very important stuff... and may have another 20-40GB of stuff that's I would like to have.

If it can be extracted and burned to DVD, that will be fine.

If I had reset the partition does that completely corrupt the data? Or is the data still there in some form? I guess I'll see tomorrow...


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Response Number 33
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 7, 2007 at 20:56:27 Pacific
Reply:

The data is still there. Reading it from a Windows machine is probably not possible. Changing the status of the drive from active to not would probably result in the drive reverting to the entire 298GB. I would recommend not trying anything until you see if Knoppix can retrieve files or not. It is kind of like perfoming a quick format. All that does is wipe out the file system of the drive. That is what I think you currently have.

File recovery programs would probably also work. Most aren't free.

When installing Knoppix verify the path Knoppix will install the files it needs to install. Don't write to the 320GB.


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Response Number 34
Name: joebann
Date: August 9, 2007 at 04:01:03 Pacific
Reply:

With Knoppix I went to "Media" and looked in all the "hda" and "hdb" areas. If this is correct, no files could be seen in hdb, which I'm guessing is the second drive.


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Response Number 35
Name: OtheHill
Date: August 9, 2007 at 05:32:50 Pacific
Reply:

Just to be sure things are working. Do you see files on hda?


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Response Number 36
Name: joebann
Date: August 17, 2007 at 07:15:30 Pacific
Reply:

Sorry about the delay. This problem occured the day before I was scheduled to move. Finally got internet, and back online now.

I did see all the files on hda and its partitions.



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