"I think there is a little confusion between a branded OEM version supplied by a computer manufacturer like Dell and a generic OEM version that I might buy for a computer I had built myself. I would hope that in the latter case transferring to another computer would follow the same rules for a full retail version. I have built a number of computers that fall into the latter category but have not yet had the opportunity to put it to the test." You *can* use the non-branded OEM version to install on another computer, but it is not legal. An OEM version of Win XP is tied (legally speaking) to the hardware on which it is installed. Michael J

0

>> You *can* use the non-branded OEM version to install on another computer, but it is not legal. An OEM version of Win XP is tied (legally speaking) to the hardware on which it is installed. << So if one of these computers goes up in smoke I have to go out and buy another copy of XP. You can sod that! I would like to see Microsoft test it in a British Court! This computer I am working on now has a full retail version and that can be transfered to another computer - so why not an OEM version. The only difference is that with he OEM version, MS provides no support. Stuart

0

I do remember reading somewhere that you can call Microsoft to let them know that you're transferring the OS to another computer (and you have to guarantee that you're deleting it from the old computer). When one of my computer's motherboard died, I had to re-install Windows XP. I didn't have the oem cd (it didn't come with the computer when we bought it at Fry's). So what I did was pop in the cd for a different computer to install the OS, and then I called microsoft and told them that the motherboard died on me and that I was trying to re-install the OS. I then gave him the product key from the sticker on the case, and he gave me a code to type into windows to get it to activate. So basically the software you use isn't as important as having the product key, and it is definitely transferable (I upgraded the motherboard and other system components so that it's technically a new machine with new hardware...ie: the os isn't tied to hardware)

0

"So if one of these computers goes up in smoke I have to go out and buy another copy of XP." Yes. "I would like to see Microsoft test it in a British Court!" It's been this way since XP launched and it hasn't been ruled illegal anywhere that I'm aware of. "The only difference is that with he OEM version, MS provides no support." No, it is not. From Microsoft: "These OEM licenses are single-use licenses that cannot be transferred to another computer. Windows XP can only be installed on a single computer. A new license is required if you install and activate the product on a different computer." Now, as I said before you *can* reinstall an OEM copy of Windows XP on another computer - it's just not legal. This does not apply to many of the OEM versions that ship from the major manufacturers, such as Dell, since those copies look for specific hardware in order to install. Michael J

0

"I would like to see Microsoft test it in a British Court!" It's been this way since XP launched and it hasn't been ruled illegal anywhere that I'm aware of. I don't think it has been tested in a court, certainly not in a British Court. Until it is tested in a Court of Law it is meaningless. Governments determine the law, not Microsoft. It is reasonable that the software can only be used on one computer at a time. If one goes up in smoke and you install it on another, you are still only running it on one computer. Perhaps that is why it has not been tested in a court because Microsoft would probably lose because as is unreasonable to force people to buy a new copy of their software because the hardware broke. Probably why Microsft will give out a new code becasue they know if they dont, they are onto a hiding to nothing. "The only difference is that with he OEM version, MS provides no support." No, it is not. So what other differences are there? Stuart

0

The fact that it has not been ruled illegal AND that it has been sold this way for so long would infer that 1) It was tried and found legal or 2) No one ever brought a case because there was no case to begin with. I find it hard to believe that no one would have brought a class action lawsuit if there was a good case here. You can argue with me all you want. I'm not supporting the licensing that comes with the OEM version, I'm just stating what it is. You don't have to believe it, you can choose to remain ignorant if you want. "So what other differences are there?" Exactly what I said before. The OEM version is tied (legally speaking) to the hardware on which it is installed. You cannot, legally, remove it from that machine and install it on another. There is nothing technically preventing you from doing this (and I have), except with the OEM discs that come from some manufacturer's like Dell. Their disks do a hardware check before installing. Here are some more links: "OEM versions of Windows XP are licensed together with the hardware with which they are purchased, as an entity, and such a copy may not be moved to a different computer." (http://www.aumha.org/win5/a/wpa.php) "In general, OEM software may not be transferred from one system to another system. However, the computer system can certainly be updated with new components without the requirement of a new software license. The only exception to this is the motherboard If the motherboard is replaced the computer system is deemed "new" and a new license would be required" (http://www.michaelstevenstech.com/oemeula.htm) If you really believe your position to be true, how bout you provide some proof. Michael J

0

1) It was tried and found legal or Not that I know off. 2) No one ever brought a case because there was no case to begin with. It is up to Microsoft to bring the case as it is their EULA that is being contravened. While the consumer can quite easily ignore the EULA, they have no reason to bring a case. >> If you really believe your position to be true, how bout you provide some proof. << Proof of what. Proof of what I believe. As I said earlier, I have not yet put it to the test. I do believe the Microsofts position is unreasonable regardless what their EULA says which has little standing in law till it is teted in a Court of Law. Show me proof where someone has been successfully prosecuted by MS for contravening the EULA regarding using an OEM version on a second computer. Thats is why MS brought in Product Activation as most EULAs are unenforcable. If it cannot be enforced by law then legality doesn't enter into it. Thats what I meant when I said governments make the law, not Microsoft. Just becasue MS says it is so, doesn't make it illegal. I have a Dell branded copy of XP which came with my laptop. After I had slipstreamed it I discovered the it would do a clean install without prompting for activation. I then tried it on another Dell laptop and it did the same. Both laptops have now been running with the same copy of XP on them for nearly two years. Each installation generates if own installation ID different from the original. It even works with Windows Genuine Advantage. Nothing I did deliberately, it just happened. So sue me Microsoft! Stuart

0

"It is up to Microsoft to bring the case as it is their EULA that is being contravened. While the consumer can quite easily ignore the EULA, they have no reason to bring a case." What I meant was that no person(s) or government has sued MS for it's EULA being illegal. Wether MS decides to sue over a violation of the EULA is up to them. just because they decide not to do so doesn't make it legal. A company can put just about anything into their EULA. If they say you can only use the software the 3rd Tuesday of every month, then you agree to that by accepting the EULA. If you don't agree to it then you don't have to buy the software. just because someone creates the software doesn't give you the right to use it however you please. "I do believe the Microsofts position is unreasonable ..." Yes, I agree with you. But, by agreeing to the EULA you are entering into a binding contract. I'm not saying it is right or moral. But, it is legal. Michael J

0

"It is up to Microsoft to bring the case as it is their EULA that is being contravened. While the consumer can quite easily ignore the EULA, they have no reason to bring a case." What I meant was that no person(s) or government has sued MS for it's EULA being illegal. Wether MS decides to sue over a violation of the EULA is up to them. just because they decide not to do so doesn't make it legal. A company can put just about anything into their EULA. If they say you can only use the software the 3rd Tuesday of every month, then you agree to that by accepting the EULA. If you don't agree to it then you don't have to buy the software. just because someone creates the software doesn't give you the right to use it however you please. "I do believe the Microsofts position is unreasonable ..." Yes, I agree with you. But, by agreeing to the EULA you are entering into a binding contract. I'm not saying it is right or moral. But, it is legal. "OEM Windows licenses (the ones that come with a new computer) are not transferable. When you stop using that computer, that Windows license must be retired. You cannot use it with the new computer you just bought, or any other. If you give the computer to a charity, Microsoft requires they remove Windows, making the computer essentially worthless." (http://www.aaxnet.com/topics/slicense.html) Michael J

0

>> Yes, I agree with you. But, by agreeing to the EULA you are entering into a binding contract. I'm not saying it is right or moral. But, it is legal. << I doubt if a British Court would see it that way. It would probably come under the category of an unenforceable contract. An example, nothing to with software. I Once bought a book some time ago from a Book Club. You know the type, by a book at a knock down price and all you have to do is buy three more within twelve months at the full price. A bought a book cheap, Upgrading and Repairing PCs by Scott Meuller as it happens (Highly recommended). The full price was £43. I got it for £5 on the understanding I bought three more books at full price. I didn't buy three more books so the Book Club tried to bill be for the full price of the original book. Their argument was that as I had bought the original book at a knockdown price I had contracted to buy three more books. Numerous letters threatening me with recovery action and letters from lawyers threatening all sorts of dire consequences if I didn't pay up followed. After an invitation from me to see them in court, they dropped it. I have done that a few times. I have the complete works of Shakespeare for £9. I have probably been black listed by every mail order book seller in the country now. Book Club agreements like this are unenforceable contracts and they have been tested in a Court of Law. So I believe would be MS EULAs if MS every went that far. Stuart

0

Lets not get off track. Dell did pay MS for that copy. MS in out nothing so that can't complain. If MS has an issue then they need to raise the price they charge Dell. By the way there are also any number of systems that do this and not just Dell. We get all sorts of computers from HP and Seimens and others that we throw the OS away on.

0

"I have done that a few times. I have the complete works of Shakespeare for £9. I have probably been black listed by every mail order book seller in the country now." So you knowingly enter into an agreement with the full intention of not fulfilling your obligation? As I said before, no one is forcing you to enter into the contract - you do so willingly. The fact that the companies above did not take you to court is probably due to the fact that the reward was not worth the cost. Where's your link to a court decision stating that their policy wasn't legal? Does that decision cover the MS EULA as stated above? So who's actions are less moral? MS's for having a stringent EULA or your's of entering into contracts with the intent to break them? My whole argument was not about whether what MS does is right or wrong. I was simply answering the question concerning what the restricions in the licensing are. I did that. Your whole point of view is based on the fact that you believe that a company does not have a right to sell it's software in the manner it wants to. And if you don't "agree" with the way a company does business then you feel it is OK to cheat them. Now that you have made your integrity (or lack thereof) apparent, I see no need to carry this discussion on any longer. Michael J

0

"OEM Windows licenses (the ones that come with a new computer) are not transferable. When you stop using that computer, that Windows license must be retired. You cannot use it with the new computer you just bought, or any other. If you give the computer to a charity, Microsoft requires they remove Windows, making the computer essentially worthless." This is not entirely true. I am not trying to prolong this argument, only trying to tell you of my experience with OEM software. I have a genuine OEM disk from MS. I have recently installed this same software on the third computer. The previous two were retired and scrapped for parts. MS activated all installation over the Internet without any hassle. Now if the above statement is true how have I been allowed to do this? It seems that MS is in contravention of their own EULA. Comments please.

0

>> Your whole point of view is based on the fact that you believe that a company does not have a right to sell it's software in the manner it wants to. << That's about the long and short of it. Any company only has the right to sell anything under conditions according to the law. Not conditions it makes up itself. In the UK it's called Contract Law and The Sale of Goods Act. If company choses to impose unenforceable contracts onto it's customers then that's their problem, not mine. An error that cost the book club money money as all business mistakes do. I cant find any reference to Books Clubs that I mentioned. It was that long ago that it is probably not on the Internet. One thing I did find though is a book club with a rather extensive contract agreement that has to be sent to the customer and and the customer has to sign and return it. Something that never happened in my case. The only "contract" I had was small print in the original advertisement. Under The Sale of Goods Act, the contract is between the seller and the customer. Therefore there is no contract between me and Microsoft, regardless of how much software of theirs I have on my computer as I have never dealt directly with Microsoft. My contract was with PC World, Simply Computers etc, and the contract was fulfilled when the goods were delivered and paid for. Anything is is open to interpretation in a Court of Law. >> It seems that MS is in contravention of their own EULA. << They probably are as the ELUA is just there to scare those ignorant of the law as the book club tried with me. Stuart

0

I ran acrooss a Dell branded XP Pro. I tried installing it in my Dell Dimension V350 (350 Mhz). It installed but it asked to be activated within 30 days. I hear the branded CD'S look for a code in the BIOS. This was a Dell so it should have activated but it didn't. There are alot of Dell branded OEM disk Xp Home pro and Win2k om ebay. But there is more Xp pro than anything. Linksys Router WRT54G PC-1 Gateway P4 1.8 256 MB Ram. 40 GB Harddrive Win XP Pro PC-2 Dell Dimension V350 350 Mhz 288 Mb Ram 20 Gig Harddrive 40 Gig Slave Windows 2000 P

0

>> I hear the branded CD'S look for a code in the BIOS. << Not all of them. Dell produce OEM disks that are no different than ordinary disks except they they have the branding. I have one myself that came with my Dell laptop. It installs like any other XP CD accept that it plasters the desktop with loads of Dell crap. I have also installed the same disk on a non-Dell computer and it worked fine. Never activated it though. Stuart

0