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I have a situation (lengthy and shown below) where after swapping my drives I receive an error message when trying to boot up at the Verifying DMI pool data screen that reads:
"Error loading OS"I am thinking that if I fdisk /mbr then I will be able to boot up this drive but am concerned of loosing the one I currently use that works fine.
I would like to know if it is possible to backup the current Master Boot Record and reuse it if necessary and, of course, how to do it both ways (copy and replace).
Thanks for reading,
BryanBackground specifics:
I have two hard drives (my PC).
Disk 1 @ 20GB (C: and E:)
Disk 2 @ 30GB (D: and F:)
I used Norton Ghost 2001 to clone C: to D: (partition to partition) in hopes of swapping the 30GB which is a 7,200 RPM drive with the Disk 1 that is only a 5,400 RPM drive.
All went well until I tried to boot.
Just below the "Verifying DMI pool data" it read:
"Error loading OS"
I was really surprised. I thought for sure it would boot up.
In checking Google and Computing.net I did a SYS C: and made sure that there was no disk in the floppy drive while trying to boot.
Another post suggested the manufacturer's software would allow me to copy the drive and make it bootable.
I used Maxblast 3 within Windows and as expected it did not copy over 2,300 files and never gave me the option to make it bootable.
I had never even tried using FDISK before and was surprised to see how limited it was for me to use. It would only allow me to format A:. When I created a DOS partition it replaced the C: with a new C: with a size of 8mb. I guess I just don't know how to use it. I am by no means PC illiterate but it beat me.
I have no problem with the concept of starting from scratch on this new drive but I do not want to have to install Windows from scratch. There is some software that I would not be able to reload and don't want to lose any of it or the data that is currently on the C: partition.
I have accomplished this task in the past without a single hitch and I believe my problem is related to the fact that at that time the drive was not originally set up to receive an OS only data. At that time the drive letters were actually:
Disk 1: C: and D:
Disk 2: E: and F:Now they are
Disk 1 @ 20GB (C: and E:)
Disk 2 @ 30GB (D: and F:)
as I would have expected them to show up.I remedied that using Partition Magic making Disk 2 [Fat32] versus [Fat32 exten d] which is why the drive letters were showing as they were.
So, I appeal to the collective for guidance to accomplish my goal to make the new partition bootable to the cloned copy of the drive that currently resides on C:.I am currently focused on trying the fdisk /mbr versus trying to explain and sort out what went wrong when I originally formatted the newer hard drive.
After the fdisk /mbr approach, if it fails, then I would likely address the other approach. But to keep this thread from becoming a large one I would like to remain focused on the fdisk /mbr approach.
I would also accept the concept that this approach is hopeless if that is a fact.Thanks again,
Bryan
Are you sure that you are following the instructions for Ghost. When you say "clone" do you mean create an image of that drive. That is the way I would do what you are attempting. In the version of Ghost I have the image can be "restored" to a partition by means of a bootable floppy that you create using Ghost. I am not sure that "cloning" copies hidden and read only files. Maybe your version of Ghost is different. I bought Norton Systemworks Pro 2003 primarily for Ghost. My 2003 Ghost can even image to networked locations. I regularly image to CDR and the program spans disks. If you are interested NSW pro 2003 at softwarenevada.com - $14.95 + $3.95 shipping per order. Comes complete with one year of live updates and many other things like norton utilities.
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Have you changed the jumpers on the hardrives?
Nothing in Life is Perfect!
I am Nothing
Therefore I am Perfect
;~}
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fdisk /mbr only works on the active hard drive (i.e the one with the C: partition).
The FDISK /MBR command is an undocumented switch used with the FDISK command that enables users to recreate their master boot record on their hard disk drive. i.e. It merely clears the MBR which gets recreated when windows runs.
When you use drive image or norton ghost or acronis tools or similar to replicate a dsik image, you do a sector by sector copy of the hard drive partition from the source partition to the destination partition.
After such a successful copy you should change the jumpering on the hard drives such that the new hard drive is located as the master on the primary IDE port.
You should also switch the jumpering on your original to be a slave.
If you are worried about the original hard drive then you can disconnect it for the time being untill you have confirmed and are satisfied the new hard drive is working as you want.
You can visit my website (Homepage link) and look up the fdisk and format guide if you are interested in that.
Hope it helps.
___________________________________________
☺ When everything else fails, read the instructions.
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Hi OtheHill, Indigian and Mosaddique.
Thank you for taking the time to read and provide feedback.
So, fdisk /mbr is not likely to resolve the problem?
I used Ghost 2001 Drive copy feature ran from the DOS Prompt. I chose, from the Menu Local>Partition>Partition.
The jumpers are all correct.When I stated that I had performed the image copy before I did in fact do it by using a cloned Image meaning I had selected from the main menu Local>Partition>Image to a third partition.
I then used Local>Image>Partition to what would then be the newly assigned C: partition after completion and then swapping the drives and jumpers.In this case, I assumed, that the only difference would be that I would skip the step of >to Image then >to Partition by going directly from Local>Partition>Partition found on the same menu item. (I could select Partition to Image or Partition to Partition).
Do you think that will make the difference, meaning these two processes are different, if I Local>Partition>Image C: to F: drive then
Local>Image>Partition F: to D: drive.
Then swap Disk 2 to Master (jumpers too) making D: as C: bootable?I was just going to do it but I'll await a reply on this as it will take a while to perform.
Thanks and Regards,
Bryan
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Hi Bryco. Have enjoyed reading all your posts
in the past. Learned a lot. My thought on this
matter is maybe the second hard drive doesn't
have an active partition. It's been a while,
but doesn't a computer only allow you one
active partition, regardless of how many hard
drives is in it? Like I said, just a thought.
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Mnymkr, Yes I too believe that to be true.
During the resetting everything I made sure that the new partition was set as active.Thank you for your thoughts too,
Bryan
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I rarely have any problems when using the HD manufacturer's software to copy a drive. But I've never used it in windows. I've always had to boot from their bootdisk and then access the option to copy the drive.
I recall an old norton utilities wherein you could restore a partition by saving that information separately, presumably on a floppy. I never tried it but I would think that probably includes the MBR info. I imagine newer norton utilities would have that also.
The fact that fdisk only created an 8 gig paritition may mean the bios is hampered by the 8 gig limitation of some older bios' although I wouldn't expect that on an 800 mhz machine. But if that were the case then it's possible a bios overlay is involved. I'm also not sure how changing things with Partition Magic may have affected the outcome.
Some cloning software doesn't copy the active bit thereby leaving the disk unbootable until fdisk is run to set it. But I believe you mentioned you'd checked that.
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The manufacturers disks only allow cloning the entire disk, not individual partitions. In this case I believe there are two partitions on each drive. I believe Bryco was only trying to move his boot drive. I also think the issue is the active partition. When making a Ghost image and restoring that image to a different drive all that is required is that you restore to a primary partition and that drive can be set as the boot drive. You can physically move cables but I don't think it is absolutely necessary. If dual booting I don't believe the second OS partition even would need to be a primary.
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DAVEINCAPS,
"The fact that fdisk only created an 8 gig paritition"
That was an 8mb partition versus 8gb.
No overlays involved with this machine as per the Maxtor manual my particular BIOS can not handle one. That is why I went with a new 30gb hard drive instead of a larger one.
This machine is limited to a drive of 32gb.I am much familiar with using Norton Ghost and made 5 separate attempts to get it right without success. I got that weird error message and it halted there.
OtheHill, No dual boot here. Active partitions were set correctly.
I am using this machine right now. It boots fine and I am still using the smaller and slower hard drive as the Primary Master. Obviously the MBR is good here.
I guess tomorrow I will try using Ghost to create Local>Partition>Image C: to F: and then create Local>Image>Partition F: to D: and then swap the drives out and their jumpers. Set the new C: drive as Active after using Auto Detect in BIOS.
If that don't work I'll try fdisk /mbr.
If that don't work I'll just continue to use the current setup.
Thanks,
Bryan
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Bryan, I haven't used Ghost, but I have used xxcopy, which I assume would be similar. After cloning a HD partition with xxcopy you would need to swap the HDs, making sure to reset the jumpers if needed, then do a fdisk /mbr and finally sys C: to make the drive bootable. Note that the registry will be copied as it currently is, so you will have problems with drive letter assignments if there are currently data and/or programs installed on anything other than the C: drive.
HTH
Dave
Do illiterate people get the full effect of Alphabet soup?
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Your Post -OtheHill:
"The manufacturers disks only allow cloning the entire disk, not individual partitions".
>>>>>>>
I recently used WD newest version utilitiy and it allowed selecting individual partitions and partitioning new hdd with 2,3,etc partitions as well as cloning old C: onto the first partition of new hdd.
It booted right up as C: but named new hdd disk-2.
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Thanks for that heads up DublA. I wasn't aware of that. Do you know what the version number is?
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A suggestion. Get Ranish Partition Manager (RPM). It is very small and fits on a floppy. It gives a very good graphical view of all the partitions on your hard drive/s.
Boot up with it and graphically view your partition information for any inconsistencies. It will even tell you which partition is the boot partition.
If you want to know more about RPM then visit my website. There is a lot of information there about using it.
Also dave357's suggestion of doing sys C and fdisk /MBR is worth trying on your new replacement drive.
Hope it helps.
___________________________________________
☺ When everything else fails, read the instructions.
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Instead of using RPM, use the GDISK that comes with Ghost to check things after you have them set up.
eg: GDISK 1 and/or GDISK 2
and you can do this inside Win98 from a DOS prompt or in pure DOS. Also can use GDISK to set active partition if need be. Use GDISK ?
for complete syntax. GDISK can set up new HD also in pure DOS.
I suggest that the partitions should be the same size .. maybe not necessary but why take chance. 8 MB partition is not large enuff for Win98 .. big enuff for DOS 6.22; 1 GB minimum, 2 - 3 GB best.
8 MB is too small for a partition .. do 17 MB minimum so it's FAT16 instead of FAT12.
Make sure you are doing the clone into a primary partition and not into a logical partition. Here is a little GDISK script to set up a second drive:2 /MBR /WIPE /Y
2 /CRE /PRI /SZ:17 /FOR /Q /V:DOS /-32 /Y
2 /CRE /PRI /SZ:17 /FOR /Q /V:DOS2 /-32 /Y
2 /CRE /PRI /SZ:2400 /FOR /Q /V:WIN98SE /Y
2 /CRE /EXT /Y
2 /CRE /LOG /SZ:40P /FOR /Q /V:FDRIVE /Y
2 /CRE /LOG /FOR /Q /V:GDRIVE /Y
2 /HIDE /P:1 /Y
2 /HIDE /P:2 /Y
2You can get the idea from this anyway. Key them in one at a time from pure DOS then clone into the third primary, swap drives.
Best
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To OtheHill,
Not the one that came with the unit, I had to get it off their website.
WD Data LifeGuard ver 11.0 - DOS
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After reading these last few posts I figured I'd post how everything is setup according to Partition Magic.
And now see that the second entry shown directly under the D: drive (1st partition of Disk 2) is different then C: drive configuration where the 1st entry on C: is shown as Active and it is that undeclared portion of D: drive that is Active instead of the first portion.
I bet that is the problem if I can just figure out how to remedy that. I will work on it tomorrow.
It also does not have that 7.8mb Unallocated portion on F: drive as it does on the E: drive.
Note: I did nothing to it today because when I was about to use Ghost we experienced 3 quick power outages. Not enough to reset the digital clocks but enough to restart my PC each time. Glad I hadn't started Ghosting yet.
Will post back.
Thanks for the continued input.
Bryan
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Got that on 7.8 MB.
The reason to leave that 7.8 is for Norton
likes it. For example if there ain't 7.8 at least at the end of the drive unused (it can be inside an extended but not allocatted)
when you run NDD (DOS) it gives ERROR allocation, would you like to fix ?Sounds like you found the problem ...
wrong active. Note that when clone from an image anyway, ghost will set it active if it was active in source. Check afterwards for only one active on each drive.
Again: recommend same size primary parts.Best
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I finally found the time to correct the Active partition and have complete success.
Partition to Partition worked just fine too.
Thanks to anyone whom sees this,
Bryan
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Hi DAVE, Yes that was the basis of the problem.
The problem was compounded in the early stages.
When I first installed the hard drive I had set it to only receive data and not an OS.
Then, a month or so ago, when I formatted it, in my unfamiliararity with FDISK, I was only able to set the entire drive as Active instead of the partition only because it was not set up to receive an OS. I didn't realize that I hadn't set it up originally to receive an OS. At that time I was working with FDISK, Ghost and PQ Magic and got lost in my own confusion.
On May 11 and Post #18 above I then knew what the problem was.
After waiting a couple of weeks (May 31) I ran through the process as if I knew what I was doing and all worked out as it should have in the first place.
I actually formatted the newer hard drive's first partition, from within Windows while it was still attached as Primary Slave. I did a Full format and copied the System files to it.I then used Ghost to clone the drives Partition to Partition.
I swapped out the drives, Auto detected them in BIOS and then using FDISK set the C: partition as Active.
Thanks and best regards,
Bryan
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