Broken English is a given here...this is certainly an international forum. Either read and try to answer the post or ignore it Ryan; sure don't delete it. IMO, the same pretty much applies to posts with no pertinent information; most will provide more info after being asked to. I could name a stack of regulars who began thinking this place was a kiddie chat room. Only a few totally ignore everything asked and/or offered. Skip

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i no, rte/ u shld rte gudr. DerbyDad03: 2 - Take the opportunity to teach the poster a little something about life, such as the more effort they put into a post, the better a response they will get. I've tried that, and I find the response is either non-existent, or boringly hostile. You could simply delete it, but do you really think that would improve the quality of their future posts? If we're lucky. Our chances would improve if Computing.net provided feedback to the deleted poster. Not that it would matter; those people who show such disrespect to this (for lack of a better word) community rarely post a second time.

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Where do you see disrespect? How do you know when a politician is lying? His mouth is moving.

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re: response # 6 Right, because that's always well received ;) I do it all time in the Office forum. More often than not the follow-up response is along the lines of... "Sorry for not being clear. Here's what I want to do..." Occasionally we'll get the old "English is not my first language" reason but it's usually followed by an attempt to clarify the question. It works for me...maybe it's the way I point out that we need more info before we can help.

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"Where do you see disrespect? " a) Not bothering to thank advisors. b) Not indicating whether the information was useful. c) Not bothering to check spelling, meaningless sentences. d) Typing in caps with no punctuation It all adds up one way or another! http://ewen.uuuq.com/

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I would have used other adjectives to describe those things but if I see a post that isn't clear for one reason or another, I have the option of doing one of two things. One is ask for clarification. The other is to go to the next post. I usually go to the next post unless I think that the original poster is capable of clarifying his problem. How do you know when a politician is lying? His mouth is moving.

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You are right in that it is easy to just ignore the post and move on, or to ask for more info. But that doesn't take care of the problem. I'm not "pissed off" because my time is being wasted. The real problem is that it hurts the other posters with problems. This happens in many ways, but I'll explain three of them. First, there is a finite amount of time each person can spend helping others on here. Every minute a "helper" spends asking for more info (that should have been provided up front) or explaining the board rules/general etiquette, is a minute detracted from the help someone else could be getting. It may not seem like much, but it adds up. Second, these posts clog up the system. Legitimate posts are pushed out of areas such as the "Recent Posts" box and may therefore not get the attention they deserve. They also make the search function less useful, as someone searching for their problem may have to look through a bunch of posts with no real content that happen to have keywords in them. Finally, I look at computing.net as not only a "live" help forum, but an archive of problems and solutions. While the poster may get his problem resolved, it is difficult for an outsider to determine if the problem/solution matches their current problem when the thread starter isn't clear. I'm not advocating any sort of grammar-Nazi cleanup campaign, I'm just suggesting that computing.net be more proactive in removing posts that offer little chance of being solved (due to the original posters ambiguity or lack of common etiquette) or that contribute nothing to the community and offering to help. -Ryan Adams Free Computer Tips and more:http://RyanTAdams.com Paid Tech Support: Black Diamond

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To me, it's not as bad as it is to you. I'm content to skip those posts. When water hits a rock it goes around it. I'm doing the same thing. At this point, it's up to the owner of computing.net to make any changes. Let us know if you get the job. How do you know when a politician is lying? His mouth is moving.

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I have followed this thread with some interest. I tend to especially agree with the views made by RT in #13. That said, guapo is correct in #14. In the end it is not our decision to make. Some time back when major changes were made in CN we lost many valuable contributors. Of late I am getting kind of frustrated myself. When I first started frequenting this board it was more self regulated than it is now. What I mean by that is if someone posted a completely wrong answer they would be challenged, which I think is good. Now I see newbies that ask a fundamental question and try helping both in the same day. I trolled here for a year before posting any answers. Most computer help forums have a large percentage of wrong or misleading answers on them. Unfortunately I think that is the direction this board is heading. We are becoming too politically correct. When a regular here is a little impatient with the OP they are now challenged. This leads to more frustration. I could go on but I am rambling. To sum it up I think that a certain level of professionalism should be strived for. If a poster is too lazy to use spell check, or post basic system information, then perhaps their post shouldn't be here.

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Many people would like to be a moderator. But the best thing to do is to just be yourself, help others & respect everyone else. And hope you get chosen or suggested by a mod or admin. They are the ones who will be able to see whether you will be good for the job by seeing how well you comment to others. *************************** Need BatchFile Help ? Msg me :) ***************************

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Ok, I'm going to pop my 2 cents in so bear with me. I've been hanging in computing.net since the late 90's. First, it's impossible for anybody to "waste my time in here" in any way shape or form. I choose to hang out in here and help when and where I can. Ergo, talking of wasting time is self flagellation. NOBODY is asking us to help. We donate our time, experience and knowledge. If this were a job I was being paid to do, then yes, it's possible that my valuable time could be wasted. If you honestly feel your time is being wasted by certain posts, then I really do think you should take a good look at what you're doing here and why and consider going away and not coming back. Second. I try to always get clarification when I'm not sure what the poster is asking. I'm human. I make mistakes, I misunderstand and respond incorrectly and I lose my patience (usually only when having a bad day IRL). I can be terse, rude, arrogant. But I do honestly always try to give a clear and concise answer when I can. I also avoid trying to answer when I don't know the answer. Misinformation is worse than not answering. I've corrected others when they were wrong, and I have been corrected and thanked whomever was kind enough to straighten me out. You see, one of the reasons I keep hanging out in here is that I continue to learn from other peoples Q&A's. In fact, it's that which keeps me coming back and not seeing my name in lights when I respond. I honestly try not to be rude although I frequently sound it I'm sure, and usually preface those responses with, "I don't meant to be rude....." I always have the option not to respond and frequently don't when the question is poorly phrased or makes no sense. I have to agree that if you don't like how a question is phrased, spelled, caplitalized (or not) or has poor grammar, you should ignore it and carry on. Penalizing someone, or worse yet, berating them, for not having English as a first language is not fair or right, IMO. Anymore than penalizing/berating someone to who English is their first language, but they're barely literate, or they're old/young and their understanding of computers is limited etc etc etc. I come here to help........period. I feel knowledge is something that should be shared, not kept to ones self. If you're not here to help people, then I suspect you need to find something lelse to do with your time.

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Hi, I thought I'd weigh in (sorry for the delay). I think there are two strategies for site moderation. The first is to have a bunch of different moderators who can remove and edit threads. The second is to have hardly any and rely upon non-moderators to report bad threads. Each option has its pluses and minuses. I think the main advantage of the "almost no moderator" option is that there is no resentment. Pretty much everyone on the site is equal, which creates less ill feelings and competition. A downside is that people who use the site a lot rightly feel they should be distinguished from newcomers. The main advantage of the option with a lot of moderators is that problems are taken care of more quickly. A disadvantage is a lack of control and different moderating styles among people. As you can see, there is no right answer. For now, I choose the almost no moderators style. It has been working fairly well, but, perhaps, in the future I will change. If that is the case, I will need a bunch of new moderators (which I will have to find at the time!) Justin

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@ Curt R Man, that was rude. Kidding! I agree almost 100%. The almost comes from my anal personality which makes me wonder why some people don't care enough to at least spell correctly, capitalize correctly, punctuate correctly, etc. I'm not talking about ESL issues, but posts like this, which was the response when I asked if the OP had looked at the Excel help files: yes I di but im new to excell. That is not an issue with Englsh not being the first language. That, IMHO, is complete laziness. It also makes me wonder if the problems that the OP was having with his formulae relate to the fact that he can't (won't?) spell or punctuate a sentence correctly. Leave a comma out of a sentence and it might still be readable, but leave a comma out of an Excel formula and it's useless - or worse, it returns the wrong value. I'm not perfect. I spell things wrong sometimes. There may even be some mistakes in this post. However, when I see 6 things wrong in an 8 word sentence, I have to wonder. @ Justin I agree 100%. Less is more.

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Quote from othehill: "To sum it up I think that a certain level of professionalism should be shrived for. If a poster is too lazy to use spell check, or post basic system information, then perhaps their post shouldn't be here." Shrived for? Spell check? Sorry, I couldn't resist. How do you know when a politician is lying? His mouth is moving.

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Damn, the ONLY thing spell check highlighted just now was the word guapo, LOL.

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That's 'cause shrived is a word.

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I guess, rarely is the question asked: Is our children learning? Jabbering Idiots: Everywhere You Look!

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Shrived is a word? Does anyone actually use it? What does it mean? How do you know when a politician is lying? His mouth is moving.

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guapo: What does it mean? Hint: I linked the word.

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My two cents worth... Been coming here since late 90s. If in the WinXP forum and the post's subject is WinXP I don't even open it same as any post that gives no indication of the poster's issue. I have grown to like the "Report Offensive Follow Up For Removal" button. I use it everytime I see someone spamming the board after adding my "Spam" comment next to the price of the "free" offering. There is no reason it cannot be used to report 'Offensively written" posts and the like. Less moderators works for me since I got banned from another site where I had complained about the moderators having a contest to see who could anger more of the regular contributors. I don't miss them and their childish ways. Bryan

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I certainly will never use that word. How do you know when a politician is lying? His mouth is moving.

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"to free from guilt. Isn't that what alcohol is for? LIR

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I think we as a community have done a decent job of filtering out most of the bad posts. I don't like the idea of having to many moderators. We've all seen other forums ruined by over zealous moderators. I don't even remember when I first joined c/n but I'd guess about 99 and it does seem that there are more "sloppy" posts lately. I like others here have been a little harsh with some posts but I notice when this happens it is usually caused by the op not posting enough info or describing what their trying to achieve. Most of us saw a recent op that posted 6 times (I think) about the same hardware. Each post was just a new step to what he was trying to do (video card upgade). Jam and others tried to help but getting info out of him was like pulling a rhinos tooth with tweasers. And yet the op accused jam of being rude after jam became frustrated with the ops posts. But I still don't want to see a lot of moderators. Most of us have disagreed at 1 point or another but we get past it and go back to "trying" to help others ( ra ra ra us lol). Maybe a seniority rating? Othehill wins I think lol. I love coming here and discussing comp issues because I can help others and learn from others without someone other than my piers looking over my shoulder. Thx all and drive safe. Spell check complete ;). WinXp Amd 64 3000 Msi Neo2 Platinuim 1 gig ddr 400. When we cast a pebble into a pond we should look past the first ripple.

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I can't recall how long I have been coming to CN (senior moment) but I do know at least two regulars here that have more posts than I do. They are jam and jennifer. I am sure there must be many others. To quantify the quality of the posts here at CN I would say we are attracting more of the totally clueless group. That would be OK if that group as a whole wanted to learn. I don't believe that to be the case. I get irritated by the posters that just want instant gratification. They justify their actions by stating they are noobies. I believe these folks DO know how to use search functions, they are just too lazy. I attribute this trend to the affiliation with Tom's Hardware. I could elaborate further but don't want to at this time.

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I attribute this trend to the affiliation with Tom's Hardware Is that good or bad - asks Alfred Vericel (Picture HERE) - Best Of Media Group CEO & owner of www.tomshardware.com www.tomsguide.com www.tomsgames.com i_Xp/VistaUser

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Oh I agree oth it has gotten worse. Whether its some one just being lazy or a bigger issue. Anymore I've been glancing at the posts and skipping more than the usual. Like others here I'm getting tired of posts like "cd stoped workin wuts wrong?". Most will try to give more info but some your lucky if you get a model # or whether its a desktop or laptop. But I wonder if it would be possible to have a check box like "problem solved" that the op checks (hopefully). That way there would be a filter of sorts for us. I've seen that else where and if implemented right it seems to help a lot. WinXp Amd 64 3000 Msi Neo2 Platinuim 1 gig ddr 400. When we cast a pebble into a pond we should look past the first ripple.

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In defence of some ops atleast some of them come back and let you know if the problem was solved and actually say thank you. WinXp Amd 64 3000 Msi Neo2 Platinuim 1 gig ddr 400. When we cast a pebble into a pond we should look past the first ripple.

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re: some of them come back and let you know if the problem was solved and actually say thank you Some, but not enough. I'm not implying that computer related questions are easy to answer, but I know that I spend a considerable amount of time testing the solutions I offer for Excel related problems. I try to add comments in my code so it is easy to follow and I try to explain my solutions so the OP can learn something, not simply solve their immediate issue. It kind of sucks when you spend a half hour (or more) putting together and testing a solution and then never find out whether your solution helped, hurt or was even read.

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"To quantify the quality of the posts here at CN I would say we are attracting more of the totally clueless group. " This is so true... I can remember when posts on the old forum could be read and understood and people THANKED contributors for their help. I read these pages on a daily basis mainly just to gather information and knowledge and the quality of the posts I read now is just appalling. Very few come back after getting an answer and as DerbyDad03 says it must be very frustrating to be left in the dark http://ewen.uuuq.com/

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I'm always in the dark. Lol. Trucker who works on computers as a hobby and occasionally let's his 3 brain cells wander! Lol. WinXp Amd 64 3000 Msi Neo2 Platinuim 1 gig ddr 400. When we cast a pebble into a pond we should look past the first ripple.

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agree 100% with Curt R. To the point where I don't actually need to say anything else. So I won't.

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I am kind of on both sides of this issue. From my point of view asking for help: before I get here I have researched the issue as best I know how. So when I get here and get " try google" as a response I want to slap someone. More often then not I have put in more than a few hours trying to resolve my problem before posting. That being said no I am not that highly skilled when it comes to computers but I have picked up on many things here and at other sites from a handful that have helped me and by reading other posts. Also before posting I do search for the answers to other posts. My point of view trying to help, I don't normally but in unless I have had the problem and fixed it myself. Afraid of sounding like a total moron. I used to think I was getting knowledgeable as I had been doing this with success for several years. I recently started going to school to actually learn about computers and I find that I know very little if anything at all. If you can not get you system to turn on I can tell you to plug it in. All that aside it is a bit frustrating to try and help and either not know if you did or there is no way to understand the problem. I have found that the term "crashed" can mean a lot of different things in here so when the poster simply says "my computer crashed" I am at a loss. Practice makes perfect but only if you practice perfectly!

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Oh hell we're supposed to plug them in? That's what I've been doing wrong!! Lol. ;) WinXp Amd 64 3000 Msi Neo2 Platinuim 1 gig ddr 400. When we cast a pebble into a pond we should look past the first ripple.

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Plug in the lamp haging over the desk and come into the light Trucker Lol. Practice makes perfect but only if you practice perfectly!

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Kool idea! Oops, small problem, no lamp on a desk in my truck,come to think of it no desk either! ;( WinXp Amd 64 3000 Msi Neo2 Platinuim 1 gig ddr 400. When we cast a pebble into a pond we should look past the first ripple.

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If I gut the sleeper... Bad idea! Who needs a bed? I could just mount a lazyboy back there... Very bad idea! WinXp Amd 64 3000 Msi Neo2 Platinuim 1 gig ddr 400. When we cast a pebble into a pond we should look past the first ripple.

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Ok. Understood then turn on the dome light? And I like the Lazy Boy idea. lol Practice makes perfect but only if you practice perfectly!

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How about this little gem: ------------------------------------------ i run gateway computer... at the bottom of the page of a note i click on a related site And post locked!!!! if i do not reply within 24 hour send me a pm ---------------------------------------------- The poster obviously speaks English, and must have some computer/Internet knowledge since they grasp the concepts of private messages ("send me a pm"). Anyone want to try to decrypt what the question there is? Or how about this: ------------------------------------ Title: difference between unix and window Message: send the ans ------------------------------------ Messages like that clearly indicate moderators are needed. -Ryan Adams Free Computer Tips and more:http://RyanTAdams.com Paid Tech Support: Black Diamond

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Here ya go... From the Office forum: ------------------------------------------ Subject: Trace the folders Hi, I have a text file contains 1000 folder names. In a different directory i have 50, 000 folders, i need to pick these 1000 folders from the directory. ------------------------------------------

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Use a ball peen to reformat and alter display properties. The folders will then fall out on their own. Practice makes perfect but only if you practice perfectly!

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We should have a "best of" voting button like Craigslist does. -Ryan Adams Free Computer Tips and more:http://RyanTAdams.com Paid Tech Support: Black Diamond

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Lol I like the best of idea! To bad its not politically correct! Can't have that! WinXp Amd 64 3000 Msi Neo2 Platinuim 1 gig ddr 400. When we cast a pebble into a pond we should look past the first ripple.

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