Hi there,

I've got 2 computers (one with Win2K the other with WinXP) that share a cable modem to the Web (they both plug directly to the rear of the modem). I also have a printer that has both USB/LAN connections that I wish to share between both PCs. My questions are:

1) Is it possible to use the cable modem as a router between the PCs and the printer, without any additional hardware with the exception of the additional ethernet cable from the printer to the cable modem?

2) I tried to do this by setting the ‘File/Printer sharing’ and ‘Client for MS networks’ protocols and then setting the same network name, and finally turning off the firewalls. This didn't work.
I've assumed this covers all the necessary settings, and if it is possible to use the cable modem as a router, are there any other settings I need, such as an IP address or such, that I may have missed?

3) Is it possible that different operating systems are why its not working?

4) Finally, once the printer is on the network, how do I set the PCs to 'see' the printer?

Thanks in advance. I should mention I know next to nothing on networking, so if there's anything obvious I may have missed, please do let me know!

1) That depends on the modem. What is the make/model?

2) Both PC's would have to have an IP in the same subnet in order to communicate. But, if your modem doesn't act as a switch (ie: provide LAN capability), then it won't matter as there will be no commucation path between the two devices.

3) Not likely as both are Windows, just different versions.

4) If it's a network printer (ie: has a network interface into which you plug a network cable and all devices are plugged into a switch/router) then you assign it an IP in the same subnet as the PC's and just go through the "add printer" wizard and select "network printer" and windows should find it.

You don't detail your setup so I'm assuming you have IP's for the two PC's from your ISP, either statically assigned or from DHCP.

Here are a couple of possiblities for you to create a LAN:

1) You could buy a switch (say and 8 port) and plug it into the modem and then the PC's into the switch and they should still access the internet and be able to communicate with each other....if their IP addresses are within the same subnet. This would also allow you to plug a network printer in and access it from your PC's providing the IP you gave it wasn't already in use by another client of your ISP.

2) Buy a switch and a second NIC for both PC's. Plug the 2nd NIC's on both PC's into the switch and the printer as well and create a LAN that way. This would leave your PC's connected to the modem with the 1st NIC and able to access the internet and provide you with a LAN that would be protected behind the PC's firewalls.

3) Buy a SOHO router and plug it into the modem.

Then plug your PC's and printer into it (get one with 4 LAN ports). This would allow both PC's to still access the internet and each other and the network printer as well as provide a central firewall to protect your LAN.

In my opinion, the third option would be the best way to go.

Curt R, thanks for taking the time to respond. I appreciate your help and LAN suggestions.

Re: the modem, its apparently not a well documented model. What I can tell you is that its an NEC ATU-R110H modem, manufactured in 2001. It has 4 LAN ports on the rear (which I admit is naively why I thought I could use it as a router), and connects to the phone socket via a WAN cable. Theres also a PIN socket marked 'Terminal'. Perhaps it being a 2001 model rules out the possibility of it being router-capable?

Regarding IP addresses, neither PC has any manually entered settings, since they connect to the Web via individual username/password. I guess this means they are DHCP-based? How does one assign a subnet mask in such a case?

You mentioned a SOHO router. Since a DSL cable modem is a sort of IP router in itself, this means connecting a router to a router. Does that pose any technical difficulities?

I mentioned the software settings I made (network name/protocols etc.), does one still need to set these things once a router is in place?

Would you mind if I also asked:
Do your suggestions still hold if I wish to setup a home network/internet connection via wi-fi instead? I.e. - I get a wi-fi SOHO router instead and plug it into the modem?

Thank you.

This may help.........
http://www.windowsnetworking.com/ar...

Theres also a PIN socket marked 'Terminal'. Perhaps it being a 2001 model rules out the possibility of it being router-capable?

That would likely be a "console" connection allowing one to get into the modem and set it up.

You could google the modem model and look for a guide or manual stating it's capabilities but it might be quicker just to call your ISP's tech support and ask them.

I guess this means they are DHCP-based? How does one assign a subnet mask in such a case?

Yes, this would be DHCP. Open a command prompt window and type the following command:
ipconfig /all
to view IP address settings. They should include; IP, Subnet Mask, Default Gateway, and DNS address.

You mentioned a SOHO router. Since a DSL cable modem is a sort of IP router in itself, this means connecting a router to a router. Does that pose any technical difficulities?

A modem isn't a router. Some are combo unit's (that's what I have now courtesy my provider) and do it all. Mine's a combo modem/router/wireless AP.

Connecting one shouldn't be a problem. You will have to set the WAN port of the router up for DHCP and include the login credentials for one of the two IP's you're using now.

The LAN side of the router will use DHCP and likely a class C private subnet for your PC's. Once you've connected your PC's and they've received their IP's from the router, you should have communication on the LAN (from PC to PC) and both PC's to the internet (thanks to the NAT in the router). The router will also provide firewall protection (as you likely know, a must in today's world).

Then, you hook up your printer, statically assign it an IP in the same subnet, but not in the DHCP scope. You don't want to rely on DHCP for a printer as it's IP might change causing you to have to readd the printer on both PC's.

Most SOHO router's have a DHCP scope something like this:
192.168.0.100 to 192.168.0.200
Just check the DHCP scope on your router and pick one not in that scope for your printer. Something like 192.168.0.10. You will have to statically enter the Subnet Mask manually too so check it on a PC as I described above.

I mentioned the software settings I made (network name/protocols etc.), does one still need to set these things once a router is in place?

You shouldn't have to change any of that with a SOHO router. Your workgroup name should be the same on both PC's and both should already be using the TCP/IP protocol.

Do your suggestions still hold if I wish to setup a home network/internet connection via wi-fi instead? I.e. - I get a wi-fi SOHO router instead and plug it into the modem?

Simply put, yes! :)

Then if you have a wireless capable laptop and want to connect wirelessly, you just enable the wireless NIC on the laptop and ensure it too is set to get it's IP automatically from DHCP.

Curt R & Cuffy thanks for your suggestions.

I've found out the modem I have is a plain DSL modem. Instead of the router, I've got hold of an inexpensive switch, which I've connected to both PCs and the modem.

I have tried to follow Curt R’s first suggestion of creating a LAN by switch. I can get an internet connection on both systems, but neither system can see the other, so there is no network per se.

Being a novice, I am having some issues with assigning the IP address. The guy who sold the switch to me said that no subnet masks or other settings would be necessary, it being a plug and play device. I find that hard to believe.

1) To simplify matters, I first tried to create just a LAN between the PCs, ignoring the printer and Web connection for now. I used ipconfig /all on both PCs, and got an IP address (last 4 digits different) and subnet mask (identical). However, pinging the other PC resulted in a time out. I have checked the cable connections. Could this be down to software?

2) Is there any way around the assigning of IP addresses issue – perhaps by using a router?

3) Also, there was no gateway for the PCs only for the cable modem displayed after it. Is that normal?

4) Im also concerned that the switch may not offer any security such as a firewall. Are the software firewalls on the pcs sufficient protection?

5) If I understand correctly, the router method (Im looking mainly at the wired version) circumvents many of the problems described above. If PPPoE is the extent of the technical side, perhaps the router option may be more suitable?

Thanks!

Before I say anything else I'd like to remind you of something I said previously:

You could buy a switch (say and 8 port) and plug it into the modem and then the PC's into the switch and they should still access the internet and be able to communicate with each other....if their IP addresses are within the same subnet. This would also allow you to plug a network printer in and access it from your PC's providing the IP you gave it wasn't already in use by another client of your ISP.

I probably wasn't clear enough so let me try to explain more clearly. What you've done is extended your ISP's network into your home. Your PC's are still using their IP addressing scheme so they can access the internet. Because of this, you could run into issues of duplicate IP's when you try to statically assign one to your printer. Not to mention just the basic connectivity issues you're having now.

What would be handy to know, would be the first 3 octets of your IP's. Example:
192.168.1.xxx
192.168.2.xxx

If you could post your IP's like I did above (just the first 3 octets and the subnet mask, then we can look and see if they're on the same subnet.

Ok, now to your questions:

1) As per my above. It could be the IP's themselves so please reply with them and the SM so we can verify if they're in the same subnet.

Do check your Workgroup name. It needs to be the same on both PC's.

2) I would use a router. In fact, this is your best option as I said in my last reply.

3) The PC's should have a gateway IP. This is what tells them where to send data that's going out beyond the LAN. Within the closed loop of the switch, a gateway address isn't necessary to communicate with other properly addressed/setup devices.

4) The switch won't offer any security so that's another reason I recommended the router. To be precise, a SOHO router (SOHO = Small Office, Home Office) is really a switch with NAT, DHCP and a firewall added on to it. It most certainly doesn't have the capabilities of an Enterprise level router (ergo the term 'SOHO') or the cost.

5) Again, yes, yes and YES. The router option is without doubt the BEST option. Just make sure the SOHO router you buy is capable of setting up a PPoE connection (most are).

Curt R thanks again for your explanation.

Following your advice, I exchanged the switch for a router, but I have been tinkering all night without success. I imagine that must sound strange since the router was supposed to configure most of the settings on its own!

1) I find that the only way I can connect to the Internet is by clicking the 'Connect' button from the router's built-in software (via web browser). The username/password (since its PPPoE) were all that was entered into the router. Needless to say, this is far less convenient than using a connect/disconnect dialogue box from say, the desktop. When I use one, it just says 'unable to connect'. Nor do I wish to have an 'always on' or 'on-demand' connection. Is a dialogue box not possible?

2) Both PCs are still not communicating with each other on the LAN. I know that both PCs are communicating with the router, since pinging it works. I tried tinkering with the administrator services, setting auto-obtain IP addresses, naming the workgoup identically, checking the MS client and sharing protocol boxes, disabling firewalls and rebooting, none of that worked. Unless I'm mistaken, I verified there was no network by using Network neighbourhood>Entire Network (Win2K) and Network Places>View workgroup computers (WinXP). Both of which came up blank.

Two other key points I should have mentioned were:

3) Both PCs connect to the Web via individual PPPoE settings, so 'sharing' isn't just unnecessary, it won't allow 2 PCs with the same settings to connect simultaneously. However, I find that entering PPPoE settings into the router from different PCs just replace rather than add the settings. How can one ADD PPPoE settings?

4)The printer I wish to network has a LAN port built in, so at least this should be plug and plug, without requiring any print server or settings.

My addresses, given by the router: 192.168.0.x subnet: 255.255.0.x
And 192.168.0.y subnet: same.

Sorry for all this trouble, but the hookup seems to be unusual since I can find no one with experience of - nor any networking book dealing with - two PPPoE settings and a LAN-ported printer!

Thanks again.

Sorry, there is an error in the first few setences of my second point:

"2) Both PCs are still not communicating with each other VIA WINDOWS NETWORKING. However, they MUST BE communicating since pinging ONE FROM THE OTHER works."

Thanks!

1) When I use one, it just says 'unable to connect'.

Not sure why that's happening. I suggest you call your ISP and have them walk you through setting your router up for their service.

Nor do I wish to have an 'always on' or 'on-demand' connection. Is a dialogue box not possible?

Why not? That's kind of the point of:
a) Having highspeed internet
b) Using a router - it provides a firewall and keeps the bad guys out.
c) Prevents you from having to do anything to connect from the PC other than open your browser

I do not believe a dialogue box is available with a router.

2) They're able to communicate (as verified by pinging) so you have something misconfigured. Check your Workgroup name on both PC's. It should be the same. Also, compare IP information.

Google "world of windows networking" and go to their site for some excellent tutorials on setting up a home network.

3) The point of the router is to give LAN connectivity between your PC's and printer as well as a firewall and a single connection point to the internet. The router, employing a technology called NAT (google and read if you don't know what it is) to allow all devices connected to the router to connect through the single connection point.

Each PC should be setup to get it's TCP/IP settings from the router via DHCP. This will give them unique IP's within the LAN so they can communicate and as I said above, the NAT built into the router handles the internet traffic for them both.

ERGO having a PPoE connection setup on each PC is no longer necessary!

4) You want to statically assign an IP address to the printer that is within the same subnet as the PC's. Reread my previous post about setting that up and looking at the DHCP settings on the router.

Now, go google "world of windows networking" and read and learn. Then call your ISP and have them walk you through setting up the router for internet access.

Curt R, many thanks again for your help.

Sorry for my delayed response - I have been tinkering with the system in order to avoid posting unnecessarily. So I've now got most of the issues sorted out - it seems the 'Client for MS Networks' kept switching off, (still no idea why), so it appeared as though the LAN didn't work correctly. The 'Server' services was also disabled. The printer works fine, despite I haven't really set anything up with regards to a fixed IP. I only entered a 'Static IP' with the last 3 digits outside of the predetermined IP range, into the machine directly (it has a keypad and menu) and the PCs seem to do the rest. I lost you on the 'Subnet Mask' thing - all I can say is the Subnet the printer displays, is identical to that of the one on the router/PCs. Another thing is that the software firewall is too sensitive - when its on, I STILL cannot access the printer, or the other PC. There is a 'Restricted Sites' list I can enter into, but I don't know if I use the static printer IP address assigned to the printer would be safe.

Anyway, I guess that just leaves the PPPoE issue. The reason I prefer to have the connection manual is because I don't wish to be online unnecessarily (even though I've already put the router firewall on) while I also wish to time the duration and the data in MB sent/received, which I have long used as a yardstick to see if there's anything out of the ordinary going on.

And since we're paying for 2 PPPoEs, if we are only using one, both machines will 'share' a slowed connection unnecessarily.

So we're down to just 2 questions!

1) If a dialogue box isn't possible, then is there some other way that allows one to seperate the PPPoE connections, while keeping such a connection manually-operated?

2) When I select DHCP client list, the printer doesn't show up as a client - don't know if thats normal and because the fixed IP setting excludes it from such a list?

Thanks again.