It seems that the old argument (Mac vs PC)is full of temper and mis-truths. I use both and I still prefer the Mac to a PC anyday. As I am a System Engineer and have had to support both environments, the PC fails the user survival test hands down. The Anti-Mac guy has fallen into many traps with the MHz gag and the component comparison rubbish. His arguments against macs don't hold true when put in perspective. And don't forget PC's are plagued by viruses (around 400 new a day), the last one that affected the mac was in 1998. Each platform has its uses. PC's are easily hackable, Macs are much harder to hack as their is no obvious command line. The site he referenced is a joke. And yes you can have more than one CD and HD's, and USB does not render your other peripherals as wasted. If the same argument was put to cars then the anti-mac guy would want everyone to drive a Holden. Why buy a porsche, or BMW?

0

Well, I take it that Martin Jones didn't really read my site, or he would have noticed where it said that I am a girl who used to work at my father's company's IT Help Desk troubleshooting MacOS, Windows, and Linux. But what really gets me is his claim that "the last [virus] that affected the mac was in 1998". Obviously this is not true ! One poor woman who is using a Mac just alerted the forum of her virus-related problem this morning. I have seen many viruses on our Macs that freeze up the system so badly that even the "safe mode" keys won't work ... this is because the computer's ROM loads up the MacOS GUI before the kernel is even loaded, and this GUI looks for certain non-ROM files on the hard drive once the kernel is loaded (which is necessarily the first thing that happens). Thus, if these files are corrupt, there is nothing that can be done to save the computer. I should also point out that MacOS treats its users as though they are complete idiots in that it does not allow any system files to be edited or changed, even if they are corrupt. To really fix them you need to reinstall the operating system. Mike, thank you for emailing me with your ideas. I am glad you have decided not to buy yourself a new Macintosh.

0

First off, the iMac is not the only model available and it is not intended for high end use -You're comparing Apples to Oranges. You can add hard-drives to Macs, as many as you can with a PC (it's just easier and quicker on a Mac). You can add more than one CD-ROM/CDR/RW/DVD-ROM/DVD-RAM to a Mac on IDE/SCSI/USB/Firewire. iMac display is limited to a maximum resolution just like any 15" monitor is on any platform. ATI make the cards on the high end Mac. They are identical to the PC's ATI video cards. You can use a cable modem with a Mac, Demon Internet (the ISP) just doesn't offer Mac software. There are other ISP's out there. Mhz is a measure of processor cycles per second. It doesn't take into account the size of the data chunk being processed at that speed (8, 16, 32, 64, 128 bit). If I use one hand to move a stack of cans to a different shelf at the same speed I use two hands, one will take twice as long. Same thing. All of my old peripherals are SCSI. I bought a SCSI card, plugged it and use all my old peripherals. Simple. Mac OS has had Multitasking and Multiprocessor support for 6 years now. The person from reponse 3 is way biased and obviously doesn't understand much about Macs. Mike, the truth of the matter is that one being better than the other is a matter of opinion. Both platforms have their good sides and bad sides. What matters to you is going to decide what you like best. My advice to you is to keep an open mind, try both and keep you facts straight. Don't listen to people who are biased one way or another, find out for yourself. Macs are real nice, and so are some PC's-get what you need. Good Luck, -Gerald

0

Thank you everyone for your ideas concerning Macs and PCs. I'll keep it all in mind. Right now I'm going to buy an older Power Mac and use it to get a "feel" for Macs. I still will work on upgrading my PC also. Thank you Gerald for your last post. I think you've hit the nail on the head. What I'm finding is that while most PC people love PCs and HATE Macs, while most Mac people like Macs and PREFER them to PCs. You don't find alot of bi-partisans, but I hopefully will be one. Although I have to admit, the Mac people seem to be less hostile and more hospitable, even towards PCs. One question though (no offence) Callispell (I'll use that name, not your real name), if you hate Macs so much, why are you visiting the "Mac" part of the messageboard?

0

PC is usually better. a 500mhz mac is alot quicker than a 600mh IBM, but also alot more expensive. I dont care what u do, just try to avoid linux, tis a very bad opperating system.

0

Sorry Calispell, ...but you rant and rave like a male. No I did not even go to your site. Your speel about the virus means that you can't tell an old virus from a new one, and not just a kiddie variant. Anti-mac people always talk about Macs "freezing up", strange .. it does seem to happen to our several hundred macs. Perhaps like PC idealists you never set them up properly. It is interesting to read the PC and Mac forums as your would be inclined to through both machines into the bin. Look at the PC listings for each operating system version. As Bill Gates said when he looked at the Mac .. "This is the futrue of computing".

0

Mike, you have the right attitute. There is no reason why someone can't use both PC and Mac and be happy with both. I use an HP Vectra at work with NT and a G4 at home with OS 9 and OS X. They are both good machines. Stick to your guns, Mike, you'll be fine. -Gerald

0

Okay. I'm going to get a website, and from now on, I'll just post a link to the website instead of posting my argument in here. That will prevent people from being diverted away from the main topic. By the way, over half of all Macintosh owners have never owned anything else; and there are virtually no new Macintosh buyers that had previously owned PC's. The traffic flows only one way.

0

Every body knows MACS RULE!!!!!!!

0

Calispell, "there are virtually no new Mac buyers who have previously owned PC's" Where did you get that idea from? I have used PC's for many years and only discovered Macs this year. I'm not going to slag off Windows because I still use it but I also use my Mac which I prefer so I for one will not buy a new PC again. It'll be a Mac for me. As many have said here Mike, try them both. I consider both systems to have benefits and drawbacks. Certainly for me, my Mac has been more reliable. Good Luck

0

Most of the arguments here against the mac are either inaccurate or made up. I use both macs and PCs regularly and I still prefer macs by a large margin. The interface is much more logical and straightforward, and easy to use. I find that most PCs seem to generate random problems very frequently, such as a messed up registry or corrupt driver file or blue screens or something along those lines. With PCs, you dont get anything more than USB or legacy serial and parallel ports, so macs clearly arent worse in this department. Most Macs have ethernet, modem, firewire, and usb as standard. If people stick with their legacy devices, the market will be held back. Nobody should be using floppies anymore, but unfortuantely nobody ever made a 'standard' replacement. And to the same point, PCs are still based around the 20 year old DOS architecture, thus Windows is more like a DOS program than an OS. Macs are tightly integrated with their OS, and this shouldnt be a problem for most people, since there is no need to run anything than MacOS on a mac. Macs started with a GUI OS, and were made by one company for solely that OS, while PCs, made by many companies, started with the command line DOS architecture and different companies wrote "Operating Systems" that ran on top of DOS. Apple is taking bounds to abandon legacy devices and architectures. While this may not sound good, it benefits the computer market in the long term.

0

Well, even though this post is now at the bottom of the board, I can't help but be disgusted at the rebuttal of the Mac-lover "PB". Calling Windows "DOS-based" is like calling MacOS "AppleScript-based", and I would burn my computer before I ran AppleScriptOS on it (and I never hurt computers). Sad to say, but Apple's monopoly on Macintosh operating systems has led to the preservation of an OS that is essentially unchanged since its introduction in 1984. Also, only 22% of PC's run what can truly be called "Windows". I don't have the source for that statistic, but I will tell you that only 0% of my IBM machines (of which I have many) run Windows. Much more on my website:

0

HAHAHA!!! Now you see what its like when people get their facts wrong eh? Well I went over the line somewhat just to see how seriously some people defend their computers, and it is sad. I'm not a "mac-lover", because I don't love macs. I use them, like I would a toaster or a radio. As long as a computer does the job for you why does it really matter if "my PC has a faster hard disk than yours"? People don't fight over how much power their hair dryers use. Use whatever is best for you, and don't waste your life comparing them and showing off.

0

to PB: 1) Thank you very much for reading my webpage. 2) It's okay to step over the line and stretch the truth, if it hurts Apple in the end. I admit that I've stretched the truth a BIT on my website, but this will change once I am able to properly reference all of the information there. For example, the $599 price I quoted for IBM actually is the SPECIAL LOW PRICE you get once you become one of the ELITE customers who keeps on coming back to IBM year after year and they love us so much that we get to buy their PC's at special low prices, and with any OS we want preloaded.

0

Calispell: If you scroll up this page you will see that nearly all of the 'against mac' arguments are from you. And considering you are heavily biased towards the PC side - you admitted originally this by calling yourself an "anti-mac fanatic" - and you have most of your mac facts wrong (you didnt just stretch truth a BIT, but a LOT), this does not seem to be turning into a very fair comparison at all. A new user doesn't want to hear why _you_ think macs are crap, but what they are actually superior for. You have depicted them as a crippled platform from what I have read; this is a wrong impression and won't help anybody. There is little point trying to dissuade people from buying Apple computers due to your own opinions. You can voice them, but you shouldn't try and force those opinions into other people's heads. You seem very eager that people don't buy Macs for all the wrong reasons. For example all your facts in response #5 are completely untrue, and I suggest that you stick to saying what you know, instead of putting down any things that makes the platform sound bad. Being biased as you are your comparisons are not in the least fair; you haven't even discussed the drawbacks of Windows, of which, like any OS, there are many. You stated that "MacOS treats its users as though they are complete idiots in that it does not allow any system files to be edited or changed, even if they are corrupt." The basis of this is true, but with Windows pretty much the same applies. An average user, even most experienced ones, can't edit the system files to clear out problems. Remember that MacOS doesn't have a registry or boot text file; the two OSes work completely differentely and thus a direct comparison is unfair and irrelevant. Using sentences like "MacOS treats its users like idiots" is the wrong way to put across your arguments; this type of language will make you sound childish and people aren't going to take you seriously. Finally, re. your two messages, 1) Your webpage is a complete joke (I hope that's what you intended for). In one way or another _all_ of your facts are either biased, opinionated, or just plain wrong. I have no idea where you got some of that information unless you made it up yourself. I could tell you exactly how every one of your "facts" is somehow wrong, if you wanted. 2) What is the point of that? All I'm trying to do is make sure you don't spread around the wrong picture, right now I really don't understand your logic. I think this topic may be out of your intellect, in which case you should back out. --pb

0

okay - pretty good job, pb, but reason & maturity is obviously wasted on Calispell. I'm starting a poll, right here, right now. In favor of allowing Calispell to spew her regurgitated lies all over this forum: zero In favor of bannishing her to wallow in her own blue-screen-of-death-wish: one Feel free to post your votes here - and remember, one IP addr, one vote. God bless America. BC

0

Calispell, do us all a favor and restrain yourself to singing the praises of IBM. You will do a lot more for your cause if you show us Mac users what we are missing than if you continue to rant about the misery we are all in. We use our Macs because we like them. Many of us have used PCs and/or still do. Your case is damaged significantly by your inaccurate criticisms of the Mac. I could give you a few real problems with the platform as I am an experienced Mac user. The problems with my PC just happen to outweigh them. Since you obviously are very familiar with the IBM product, you should use this venue to advertise its good points if you must, but stick to what you know. otto

0

I am an old fella with a penchant for work .... I Have used Macs for 14 years .... Started using PC's just a few years ago .... I have found many advantages to using PC's as compared to Mac's .... and I now prefer to use the PC's for a host of practical work centered reasons .... came into this forum to seek some solutions for irksome old Performa 6200 I have - one of three Macs I still have - I also still have a quaint little SE (a Gem if ever there was one) - another one I use in my work is a dual processor G4 with 1GB ram - much grief with that one so far Hmmmmm - but it was touted so much I was drawn in Arrrggghhhh!) I saw this thread and dived in .... water very muddy .... opinions and emotion without accepting realities. Simply put my Apple experience since 1986 has cost me far too much money over the years and I have found the two different PC's I have and their performance acceptable .... I have upgraded them a lot since 1998 .... and I read the manuals .... they are simpler in design/configuration than the Mac (believe it or not) and easier to comprehend - if you read the manuals. The upshot is that I can do the necessary upgrades with the PC's while with the Mac's - [and I had a slew of different models that I lost money on trade-ins with I could not]. I'm sorry but I see when I read whatI have written above it is obvious that I have stumbled to an excuse of economics .... but alas I live in the real world .... and I read and fix and repair .... and work. My experience - and I have had considerable with my 'trusty' Macs - says that PC's are for me a wiser option .... Your Experience May Differ .... I have logged about 14,000 hours on Desktops and 20,000 hours on mainframes since 1968 so I have a bit more of an intuitive feel for the beasts than many. Bottom line .... what will do the task for least $$$$ and have a prospect for compatibility and extended life .... PC's seem to be in the lead .... but a Mac is still good stuff for a variety of intensive and repetitive tasks that may not change! 2 cents worth .... From an Old Geezer

0

dude apple most of the time works on their os and thats why apple is behined of the speed but i have the frist 1GHz apple system i mad with my olad ppc and some new computer parts from dell computers hehe

0

I own a pc and recently got a mac and there isn't much difference between the computers just different interfaces and formats and programming. I still prefer pcs to macs because they are much more versatile but macs are good in that their own ways. windows and mac OS systems are simmilar if you really look at them thoroughly but I still like windows best because it is more user friendly to me and more versitile because you can change more things things to your liking. If you are really getting into computers I suggest getting a new PC and a used or new mac and get to know both kinds of computers. someday I should try to get a linux and a unix pc too. To be a real computer "nerd" you need to try all kinds of computers.

0

Now that the 766MHz PowerMacs are out with the CD/DVD Burner combos, and OS X is coming soon (March 24), you'll want a Mac. The OS X is more stable than Windows will ever be. At least for a while. In fact Mac System 7 is more stable than Windows is. I ain't kidding.

0

Follow up I guess you can call me a real "Nerd". I own a bunch of different computers. (Mostly Macs Albeit)

0

My computers are work tools, not my lovers. The right tool for the right job.

0

Let me start by saying that I've used computers for the most of my life. I started on Amiga's and the C64, then got a PC, while still using Amiga's and the occational Mac. Overall I've found the Mac OS to be more stable and have had a lot less problems with it. I have used PC's starting from about '94. I'm pro-mac personally most likely because Workbench on the Amiga is pretty close to MacOS, and although I own and use a PC for my primary computer, I don't like it nearly as much as I did Macs and Amigas. The Windows OS is too unstable and the installation of hardware or building a PC from scratch is absolutely unbearable. There is no better computer, and everyone has their own uses for them. People shouldn't so defensive about what computer their using. Most likely if they use it and don't want to change, then there's a good reason they like it.

0

Hey Calispell, Or should I call you Barrie O. Ward. I would have to guess that you're between 14 to 17 years old by your childish ignorant bantering. Yes, I do own a Mac (Several), but I am currently on my PC right now.

0

macintosh computers are much better than any wintel box!!! http://home.cnet.com/software/0-429669- 8-6112332-1.html

0

I really dot know. but my father is a oldtimer Dos programmer and he told me that Macs were better because they arent limited to Extended RAM ????? myself, I am into flash animation and audio production and I am also a web deveoper and database guy. As far as I can tell Macs are better for Graphics and Audio prod. and the system itself is far better at multitasks, while on the other hand a PC is better at alot of stuff like ASP(active server pages) and some of the database stuff. But really I dont know for sure. This is just what Ive gathered. Most of the people that talk down on Macs probably dont need to do the things that Macs are better at than PCs, so they cant see it from that perspective . just some food for thought .... Culture Z

0

sorry that email was1 letter off, its = flash@getyourmindready.com long live macromedia (whAT the wEb cAn Be!) now there's a Mac 4 you !

0

Ive been a MAC user for many years, and I have just invested in a 1.4GB Athlon with 512Mb or RAM (built myself), I have to admit its a lot fast that my G4, I was able to have a 64Mb AGP GeForce 2 3DFX card (which is amazing), the cost of parts is also a lot cheaper (trade prices). Im running windows XP and its fine, so stable and does everything I want it to do. I have to say Im favouring the IBM side after my experiences.

0