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txp4 and k62

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Name: cjae
Date: August 9, 2005 at 17:30:28 Pacific
OS: XPp & SuSe 9.2
CPU/Ram: 2.6HT/512mb
Comment:

Hi,
I have asked this before I have a asus txp4 rev 1.02 and three amd k6 2, amd k6 2+, one says 300 and the other 350

I have the Jan Steunebrink bios revision which enables these cpus. It also disables the 50mhz fsb and the 60 mhz fsb to make room for 75 and 83 mhz.

I had a p 233 mmx cpu, I also have sdram or edo which of these things should I use?

How do I get the highest clock speed out these cpus I have been trying the different multipliers but I am can't get my monitor to engage at boot. I tried several methods, any help would be appreciated.

I believe that the 2.0 multipier is recognized as 6X.

As for the monitor I know that the 83 mhz clock may make it flake, I ve tried other settings.



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Response Number 1
Name: jam
Date: August 9, 2005 at 17:57:31 Pacific
Reply:

still struggling with that old thing I see...lol

I think we went thru this before, but the TX chipset only caches 64MB of RAM. If you wanna bypass the cache limit, use the K6-2+. If you have a 5x multiplier setting, run the 350 at 375MHz (5 x 75MHz)...the 83MHz setting will put the PCI bus too far outta spec. If the default voltage is 2.2v, you may have to bump up the voltage 0.10v to 2.3v...2.4v should be the safe max.

The RAM might be a problem...do you have the board manual? Early 168-pin DIMMs ran at 5v...if that's the voltage your board's putting out for the DIMM slot, don't run PC66/100 3.3v RAM or you'll fry the RAM

ASUS A7N8X-X
Athlon XP 1800+
8.5 x 200MHz
1024MB PC3200 2.5-3-3-7
Asus A9550GE/TD 128MB
WinME/WinXP Pro SP1


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Response Number 2
Name: repo man
Date: August 9, 2005 at 20:04:03 Pacific
Reply:

I have set up at least three TXP4 motherboards using a K6-2+, the 6x multiplier, and the 83 MHz FSB to run at 500 MHz. I used Jan Steunebrink's patched BIOS on all of them. I use one everyday at work as an internet surfing machine to look up parts on. I have never found any hardware that would not run using the 83 MHz FSB. It is fast enough to run Windows XP, but the one I use every day uses Win98SE, and is very stable.

While SDRAM is technically superior to EDO, I swapped one TXP4 from EDO (192 megs) to SDRAM (256 megs), and saw no performance increase. Four 64 meg EDO SIMMs would be nice, or a pair of 128 PC100 DIMMs. There are no special voltage issues with the memory, but you have to be sure and use low density RAM, or it will only "see" half of the memory.


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Response Number 3
Name: jam
Date: August 9, 2005 at 20:26:31 Pacific
Reply:

Maybe the BIOS you mentioned has the PCI bus adjusted for the 83MHz FSB, because normally it would run at 1/2 (41.5MHz) which is generally more than any PCI card or IDE device can handle without errors

ASUS A7N8X-X
Athlon XP 1800+
8.5 x 200MHz
1024MB PC3200 2.5-3-3-7
Asus A9550GE/TD 128MB
WinME/WinXP Pro SP1


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Response Number 4
Name: repo man
Date: August 9, 2005 at 21:10:51 Pacific
Reply:

We've been going around in circles on this Jam. While I'll accept that the PCI bus being this far out of specification could cause problems, I'll never hesitate to recommend that people at least try it because I have had so many motherboards and accessories work sucessfully using it.

Jan is very good at modifying BIOS files, but I'm unaware of any way he could change the divider. And I have run several different old Asus motherboards this way prior to loading his patched BIOS. This time in 2001 I was using a P55T2P4 with a K6-2+ 475 running at 500 MHz with the last Asus BIOS as my primary machine. It could only display 400 MHz during POST, even if it was running at 500 (one of the many things Jan fixes).

You've mentioned that you have some old Socket 7 stuff laying around. Why not just slam a machine together to actually try and see how well things can run even with an out of spec PCI bus? Or maybe you'll have some sort of problem, who knows?

I've run these boards with various sound cards (both ISA and PCI), video cards, harddrives, drive controller cards, modems (both ISA and PCI). Yes, on boot when trying new hardware, I was always on the lookout for a problem that might be attributable to the overclocked FSB. But I never encountered any.


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Response Number 5
Name: jam
Date: August 10, 2005 at 05:21:07 Pacific
Reply:

I have tried it with different boards & have come to the same conclusion that I've read on numerous hardware sites...37.5MHz should be considered the safe max for the PCI bus. Why do you think early overclockable boards chose 112MHz as one of the FSB options?...because it limits the PCI bus to 37.33MHz. The next O/C step was usually 124Mhz, & on the vast majority of boards with that option, 124MHz FSB was unstable...was it because the CPU or RAM couldn't handle it?...NO, it was because it kicked the PCI bus up to 41.33MHz. Running the PCI bus at 42MHz is just asking for problems...data corruption, CD burner producing "coasters", problems with sound, etc. Why do you think the best overclocking boards provide the option to lock the PCI/AGP?

If you've been able to pull off these high PCI speeds w/o any problems, good for you...but telling be it's OK & they're be no probs is bad advice.


ASUS A7N8X-X
Athlon XP 1800+
8.5 x 200MHz
1024MB PC3200 2.5-3-3-7
Asus A9550GE/TD 128MB
WinME/WinXP Pro SP1


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Response Number 6
Name: repo man
Date: August 10, 2005 at 06:43:11 Pacific
Reply:

Ok, from now on I'll tell people that, even though I've run several Asus P55T2P4 motherboards, and several TXP4 motherboards, and a Tekram VP3 at the overclocked 83 MHz speed, using ATI PCI video cards, S3 video cards, 3DFX video cards, Western Digital harddrives, Maxtor harddrives, Creative ISA and PCI soundcards, various NICs, any number of optical drives, Promise drive controllers - and never had a problem with any of them - you shouldn't try it because it might not work.

Nevermind my Epox 8K3A+ running at 209 FSB for over a year and a half with no problems of any sort.I had to go to 215 before I had a problem. At that speed my CDRW started to get flaky. If I hadn't had to replace the capacitors, it would still be my primary system. The Nforce 8RDA3+ that I replaced it with has the all hallowed AGP/PCI lock. But it isn't even a bit faster than my overclocked KT333 8K3A+ plus was.

So you keeep telling people they shouldn't do it, and I'll keep telling them that I've had no problems, and have had systems running for years this way.

What chipsets have you tried to overclock the FSB? I had no luck with KT133 (112 max), and only a little better with KT133A (a little over 150 max). Having had so few problems doing it with other chipsets makes me conclude that the chipsets were the limiting factor, not how far out of spec the FSB was.


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Response Number 7
Name: jam
Date: August 10, 2005 at 09:27:08 Pacific
Reply:

"Having had so few problems doing it with other chipsets makes me conclude that the chipsets were the limiting factor, not how far out of spec the FSB was"

I'm talking about the PCI bus being outta spec, not the FSB, unless that's what you meant? I'll tell ya what...since you seem to feel running the PCI bus way outta spec is safe & non-problematic, why don't you take your 8RDA3+ board, keep all the default CPU/RAM settings, then bump up the PCI/AGP to say 40/80 & continue overclocking it from there. I've never tried this before, but I'd be interested in hearing your results.

I've overclocked every system I've ever owned. And when I get different boards in from upgrades, trades, flea market, etc, whether they're socket 7, slot 1, S370, socket A, etc, I always experiment just to see what they're capable of.

I'm not gonna check the specs of all the boards you rattled off..some boards DID "officially" support 83MHz FSB (even though it was never an official standard) & had a 2.5 divider. Others had the 83MHz option, but the divider stayed at 2.

Overclocking from a 200MHz base setting to 209 or 215MHz wouldn't even come close to over-overclocking the PCI bus...I don't even know why you mentioned that one?

I've had success with the KT133 & KT133E at 112MHz, but had stability issues above that...115MHz was "iffy", but 112MHz was stable. It know it wasn't due to the CPU or RAM, it may have been the chipset, I don't know...all I know is it wouldn't work. I have two KT133A boards (Asus & AOpen) & could take the FSB up to about 140-145MHz w/o issues...the RAM held me back from going any higher. But even at 150MHz, there shouldn't be a problem related to the PCI bus because it's still only at 37.5Mhz.

ASUS A7N8X-X
Athlon XP 1800+
8.5 x 200MHz
1024MB PC3200 2.5-3-3-7
Asus A9550GE/TD 128MB
WinME/WinXP Pro SP1


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Response Number 8
Name: repo man
Date: August 10, 2005 at 12:44:44 Pacific
Reply:

The Intel TX and HX, as well as the Via VP3 only have the 1/2 divider. I'll take your word for it that there are chipsets with the 2.5 divisor, but I've never encountered one.

Yes, raising the FSB raises the PCI. But low low FSB I was able to reach with KT133 and 133A (155 max on my Abit KT7A, which only results in a 38.75 PCI) and the success I've had with high PCI/AGP speeds on other motherboards makes me think that the chipset was the limiting factor, not the out of spec PCI speed.

My 8K3A+ has the KT333 chipset with the 1/5 divisor. 209/5=41.8. Anything over 209 bumped the PCI to where my CDRW wouldn't work correctly. At 209, no problems ever.

I would swap back to my 8K3A+ as my primary system board, but I now have an ATI 9800 Pro rather than an Nvidia Ti4200, and I know that ATI cards do not tolerate out of spec AGP bus speeds. That is the single advantage I can think of over my 8K3A+, that it allows me to use an ATI card. Since the TXP4 does not have an AGP slot, this won't be an issue.


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Response Number 9
Name: repo man
Date: August 10, 2005 at 21:34:40 Pacific
Reply:

Cjae, take a look at this article. A reputable hardware site sugesting that you try the overclocked 83 MHz bus speed! They do have this caveat though: The highest possible clock rates of the P55T2P4 series are 83 MHz and with this frequency the highest performance is achieved. We must clearly point out here that in this case the PCI bus as well as the ISA interface are significantly overclocked. Because of the higher PCI clock of 41.5 MHz (instead of the default 33 MHz) some older graphics cards might run into problems.

Yes, you have a TXP4, not a P55T2P4. But most of the information still applies, and all of the voltage and FSB setting you need are silkscreened right on your motherboard.


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Response Number 10
Name: cjae
Date: August 11, 2005 at 10:52:32 Pacific
Reply:

i have tried almost every setting and still
nothing I know about the pci bus setting my
problem is that the monitor will not engage
so I can see my post screen. And I do not
know what jumpers to use for the multiplier
since the bios has been modified.

I am starting to think maybe the video card
is toast or maybe I bought bad cpus. How
could I check.

And do either of you know the exact settings
jumper wise like bf0 = 2-3 for me to get
results so I can at least see my screen and
tinker from there?


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Response Number 11
Name: repo man
Date: August 11, 2005 at 17:45:56 Pacific
Reply:

Don't worry about the PCI bus for now. Have you ever been able to get this motherboard to POST? If yes, go back to the settings you used then, including the memory and CPU.

Jan's patched BIOS changes nothing as far as the jumpers are concerned.

The only way I know to see if it is the CPU or the video card is to try other ones. Try the Intel and set it to failsafe (2x multiplier, 66 MHz busspeed). You can try all of the CPUs at this setting, but you'll have to lower the voltage for the K6-2s.


Here is a link to the manual (PDF).


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