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Slow DVD burner

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Original Message
Name: eeplelife
Date: June 7, 2008 at 17:41:12 Pacific
Subject: Slow DVD burner
OS: Xp
CPU/Ram: 1 GB
Model/Manufacturer: ---
Comment:

I just bought a DVD burner and i am using DVD shrink to back up my movies. The only problem is that it is taking between 21 and 25 minutes to make the back up. My old burner took the same time and that was slower than my new one. My friend had also bought a new burner and he burns movies in 11 minutes. I was wondering what could be making by burner go slow.

My burner: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...

My friends burner:http://www.memorex.com/html/products_detail.php?section=3&CID=11&SID=15&PID=1135&FID=206&opento=11

I also read something about how the hard drive and optical drive shouldn't be on the same channel but didnt know how to check that.

thanks

Bugby The Master Elf Strikes Back


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Response Number 1
Name: aegis
Date: June 7, 2008 at 18:17:30 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

If you are copying from one drive to another, the copy time can be almost doubled if the two drives are on the same controller. For IDE drives that means they are connected to the same cable.
You want to have drives that you are copying/moving data between on different cables.


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Response Number 2
Name: eeplelife
Date: June 7, 2008 at 18:53:59 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

My hard drive and CD ddrive are on different ide cables

Bugby The Master Elf Strikes Back


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Response Number 3
Name: Tubesandwires
Date: June 7, 2008 at 20:03:23 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

I do not agree with aegis. Having the DVD drive on the same cable may lengthen the burn time a bit, but it certainly won't double it, because only one drive is accessed by the cpu at a time in any case.

How fast is your cpu?
Does it meet the minimum requirements for the drive?

Do you have an 80 wire data cable connected to the new drive?

Your new drive probably must be connected to an 80 wire data cable - it can't achieve it's fastest speeds if it isn't.
DVD combo drives capable of 16X DVD +R or DVD -R or greater run at up to UDMA66 speeds, which requires you use one.
All CDrom, DVDrom, and CD burner drives, and slower DVD burner drives, only require a 40 wire data cable if they are by themselves on a cable because they cannot run any faster than UDMA33 speeds.

If the new drive is connected to an 80 wire data cable...

- do you have the drivers for the mboard main chipset installed? If you don't, the DVD drive will probably not run as fast as it is capable of because Windows does not have the proper info about the hard drive controllers. In the same vein, older Intel chipsets also require you install the IAA (Intel Application Accelerator) in order for your drive controllers / your drives to actually acheive their max speeds.

- if that's been done, there are other things you can check.

........

What else were you doing while you burning, if anything? Burning takes a large amount of cpu time and system resources - the less you do otherwise while burning, the shorter the burn time will be.

Are you comparing burn times to your friend's case in the same circumstances?
e.g.
- if you're burning double layer and he's burning single layer, your time will be longer.
- if you're verifying the copy after the burn and he isn't, doing both takes more time.


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Response Number 4
Name: eeplelife
Date: June 7, 2008 at 20:06:13 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

I am using an old IDE wire so i dont know what type it is. How do i check and if it isnt I will probably just go to frys and get one.

Bugby The Master Elf Strikes Back


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Response Number 5
Name: OtheHill
Date: June 7, 2008 at 20:37:14 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

80 wire cables can be identified by the colored connectors. The MBoard connector can be blue, yellow, red, etc. The center connector is grey and the other end is black.


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Response Number 6
Name: aegis
Date: June 7, 2008 at 20:53:49 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

"because only one drive is accessed by the cpu at a time:

I'm afraid that is not true. Because of DMA (Direct Memory Access), the system can be reading from one drive and writing to the other at the same time. That is, as long as they are on separate controllers. The CPU just starts the read and/or write. From then on the data transfers are handled completely by DMA.


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Response Number 7
Name: jackbomb
Date: June 7, 2008 at 20:57:41 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

Does DVD shrink re-encode the video and burn at the same time, or does it encode first and then write?

Encoded:
24 Laserdiscs (480p AVC @ 2.0Mbps, Dolby 2.0 @ 224Kbps)
130 DVDs (480p AVC @ 2.5Mbps, DTS 5.1 @ 768Kbps)
47 Blu-Ray (1080p AVC @ 12.5Mbps, DTS 5.1 @ 1.5Mbps)
32 HD-DVD (same as BR


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Response Number 8
Name: samsung
Date: June 7, 2008 at 21:33:04 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

AFAIK DVD Shrink, reads the DATA, decides how small it can shrink it to, then Burns to DVD after creating an ISO.

The speed of the DVD Burner is not a big issue, that is the last stage in the process, DVD Shrink just takes time to Encode............


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Response Number 9
Name: Tubesandwires
Date: June 8, 2008 at 08:28:18 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

aegis
Whatever your reasoning, there's no way it would take twice as long to burn when the DVD drive is on the same cable, under the same circumstances otherwise, including being connected to an 80 wire cable in both cases.
...

eeplelife

You have not stated what brand name system model, or if your system is generic, what mboard make and model, you have. Knowing that would reveal a lot of things about your system that could determine how long it takes to burn.
E.g. We're assuming your mboard can support at least ATA 66 (UDMA66) drives - if it was made in 2000 or so or later it can.
If that applies, if you are using any hard drive capable of ATA 66 / UDMA 66 or greater, it/they must be connected to an 80 wire cable too in order to achieve its/their max rated speed. Hard drives made since about 1999 have that capability.

If the computer came with a CDrom (only) or DVDrom (and CDrom, only) or a CD burner, or an older (more than 2 years or so) DVD burner drive, if it is on a separate data cable, the cable probably has 40 wires.
If the system came with a hard drive capable of ATA 66 / UDMA66 or more, the hard drive is probably connected to an 80 wire cable.

If your hard drive is connected to an 80 wire cable, your optical drive to a 40 wire one, it is obvious when you look at them the 80 wire one has twice the wires.

40 wire cables can be any color but are usually grey.
80 wire flat cables can be any color, but generic ATA 100 / ATA 133 ones are often yellow, ATA 66 ones are often grey.
Virtually all data cables with round cables between connectors with 40 pin connectors, which may have been installed on a more recent computer, are 80 wire and are probably ATA 100/133.

80 wire data cables
- obviously, have 80 smaller wires - count the wires, or some of them.
- come in two types, either of which can be used - ATA 66 cables have connectors with no blocked pin holes - ATA 100 / ATA 133 cables have one blocked pin hole in each connector so that they can only be installed one way on the drive or mboard header which has one pin missing - there may be obvious printing on the cable - e.g. ATA 66 or ATA 100 or ATA 133.

IDE data cables always have 40 "pin" (pin hole) connectors, whether the cable has 40 or 80 wires; on some 80 wire ones one pin hole is blocked in the connectors - I've never seen that on 40 wire cables. The connectors look the same externally, but the ones for 80 wire cables have 40 (or so) more connections on the cable side of the connector in the middle of the connector.

40 wire cables usually have connectors of a single color, often black.

The three connectors on a three connector 80 wire cable are at least two colors (e.g. on some ATA 66 ones), often three - if there are two colors the single connector of a color goes to the mboard. There are some 80 wire cables that have two connectors, of two colors, for connecting to one drive.

The most common color for the connector for the mboard end on an 80 wire cable is blue. It almost always doesn't matter which of the other connectors you connect the drive to if you use master/slave jumpering on the drive. If you use cable select jumpering on the drive(s), the drive on the end connector is seen as master, the drive on the middle connector on a three connector cable is seen as slave.

Older mboards will not detect a single drive on an ide data cable at all unless it is jumpered or seen as master.

There are cable select only data cables (I've only seen or heard of them on some brand name systems), which are missing one connection between the middle and end drive connector on a 3 connector cable, and you must use cable select jumpering on the drives for those, but they were/are relatively rare, were/are used mostly if not exclusively for 40 wire cables, and I've never come across one on any system with 80 wire cables.
Some data cables have master, slave, and motherboard , or similar, printed near the connectors on the cable. That almost always does not indicate it can be used only as a cable select only cable.


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Response Number 10
Name: aegis
Date: June 8, 2008 at 11:51:53 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

"Whatever your reasoning, there's no way it would take twice as long to burn when the DVD drive is on the same cable"

I said "almost" Tubesandwires, and I stand by that. If it takes 15 minutes between drives on separate controllers, it will probably take over 28 minutes with drives on the same controller.

Like I said earlier, as the system is reading from one drive it can be simultaneously writing to the other drive. DMA has multiple channels to do the reading and writing at the same time.

For those interested in DMA:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct...

(edit)
The following is WRONG please disregard.
I just did a test and here are the results:
Copy on one controller - 11:30 minutes
Copy on two controllers - 5:55 minutes



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Response Number 11
Name: Tubesandwires
Date: June 9, 2008 at 12:18:43 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

Were you just copying, or were you burning?
Were both data cables 80 wire?
Both on the same controller chipset, as in primary and secondary on the same one?


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Response Number 12
Name: aegis
Date: June 9, 2008 at 15:15:50 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

I apologize tubesandwires to you, and to the others out there. My test in response #10 was flawed. I ran some more tests and found that there is very little (if any) difference in speed between copying on one controller and between separate controllers (at least on my system). It doesn't make sense to me, but that's what the tests on my system shows. I might try it on my other systems to see if there's a problem on this one. Anyway. I'm sorry for any problems I caused.


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