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slow computer- not what you think

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Original Message
Name: justasking
Date: July 1, 2005 at 16:05:40 Pacific
Subject: slow computer- not what you think
OS: XP SP2
CPU/Ram: P630(3,0)/1.5
Comment:

iv'e been using a dell (desktop) with a p530(3Ghz) and some onboard graphics card and 512 MB ram (DDR PC2700) - but yet it still seems to go faster on some stuff than my compaq x6000 laptop with a p630(3Ghz) CPU and 1.5 G RAM (DDR2 pc4200)and a radeon x600 128 MB graphics card.

this is not what you think. i know all about cleaning up the system resources and registry and i can consider myself a computer expert, but i'm stumped by this one. i ran the benchmarking tests (using everest ultimate) on both machines. my laptop met or exceeded the dell desktop in nearly all tests... but yet it's still slower in some things. why can that be? is there something still lurking in the registry which i haven't removed? i don't think so - actually i also happened to have installed windows x64 on my other partition - and it actually runs SLOWER than my 32 bit version.

the only thing that the desktop has is a better HD (probably 5400 RPM) whereas my laptop has only a 4200 RPM (40G) can this be an issue?

would it help if i would disable the paging files?

any reply about cleaning the system resources or defrag or any of that stuff will be considered by me as extremely offensive


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Response Number 1
Name: Rich Mentzel
Date: July 1, 2005 at 17:08:37 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

"any reply about cleaning the system resources or defrag or any of that stuff will be considered by me as extremely offensive"

Fussy with your free help, aren't ya!


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Response Number 2
Name: StuartS
Date: July 1, 2005 at 17:32:09 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

>> the only thing that the desktop has is a better HD (probably 5400 RPM) whereas my laptop has only a 4200 RPM (40G) can this be an issue? <<

For someone who considers themselves a computer expert and would be offended by being advised to defrag, I would have thought they would know the answer to that question already.


Stuart


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Response Number 3
Name: pheonix991
Date: July 1, 2005 at 18:29:59 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

you hear a voice in the wind "defrag, defrag."

p4 3.0ghz @ 222X15=3330mhz
512mb pc3200 dual channel @222mhz
80gb wd hdd/40gb maxtor when on linux
8x agp geforce 6200 @ 530/585can't unlock extra pipes. plz help if you can
Audigy 2 ZS<b


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Response Number 4
Name: jam
Date: July 1, 2005 at 18:31:44 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

Yea, I would think a self-proclaimed expert would at least know what speed HDDs he has in his system(s).

As I see it, you have two major problems:

1. you own a Dell

2. you own a Compaq

Asus A7N8X-X
1800+ @ 8.5 x 200MHz
768MB PC3200 2.5-3-3-7
Asus A9550GE/TD 128MB
WinME/WinXP Pro


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Response Number 5
Name: Dragon306
Date: July 1, 2005 at 18:59:49 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

stop mocking the guy people its not cool. dell and compaq systems are not the best but not horrible like ^^^ makes them out to be... my only suggestion for you, justasking, is a) stop being arrogant, it doesnt make a good impression b) format and reinstall. that's my only suggestion. i use the registry fixers and crap like that as well, but every few months i notice the system running bad so i format. i dont know why those programs arent sufficent, but formatting every few months seems essential.


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Response Number 6
Name: jam
Date: July 1, 2005 at 19:41:13 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

"formatting every few months seems essential"

damn, I hate to see that advice being given. I haven't formatted my HDD since it was installed well over a year ago. Formatting is a last ditch fix after all else has failed...it should not be a regular practice like defragging or anti-virus scans

Asus A7N8X-X
1800+ @ 8.5 x 200MHz
768MB PC3200 2.5-3-3-7
Asus A9550GE/TD 128MB
WinME/WinXP Pro


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Response Number 7
Name: rhawk7938
Date: July 1, 2005 at 23:17:01 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

I agree with jam. XP is a very solid platform and should not need to be reinstalled every few months.


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Response Number 8
Name: Rich Mentzel
Date: July 2, 2005 at 06:34:39 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

Me too the thought of "wipe and load" every 3 months is absurd. I only suggest that for systems where people don't keep up with antivirus programs and spyware removal. By the time some of them call for help, there is more time involved cleaning and repairing than reformatting and installing clean would take, so it really becomes cost effective.
90 day "wipe and load" sounds like what we used to do in 98 and this XP OS is so stable if you practice safe computing, only time I ever reformat is updating motherboard or "growing" system.


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Response Number 9
Name: Dragon306
Date: July 2, 2005 at 07:39:28 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

i dont seem to have a choice unless i want a bad-running system. i use Regisrty Mechanic 3.0 to ensure registry stability, i use PC Bug Doctor to ensure no invalid shortcuts, corrupted fonts/help files, and no invalid CLSID. I use Norton Antivirus 2004 Professional, Spyware Doctor, and Spybot-Search & Destroy to ensure no spywares, trojan, viruses, etc. and i run all winodws and security updates when windows or the programs ask me to. i use winodws xp pro. every few months i notice the system is starting more slowly and taking forever to do things, despite my efforts to keep it stable. i defrag regularly. does anyone have any other advice?? 'cause i'd be glad to hear it...


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Response Number 10
Name: Rich Mentzel
Date: July 2, 2005 at 09:11:08 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

If I could make a suggestion without offending you...with the exception of Spybot, I wouldn't recommend anything you are using, and suspect that might be the problem Dragon 36.
I would recommend Win Patrol (to tie down startup and file associations and buy it though it can be used free because the best feature will take you to a website and tell you what is trying to get in and why you do or do not need it.),Spywareblaster,Spybot, and Nod32 antivirus. I would bet you will never reformat again.
If that doesn't do it, install a second hard drive, buy Acronis True Image and make weekly image file backups. At the first sign of problems restore, forget about trouble shooting.
Before I learned this on 98, like you I would just get up every 90 days and "wipe and load". Haven't done that in 6 years and I have yet to use my restore capability though in 3 years of XP because it is so stable, but I still make them every week. I also use a data and file backup daily to work with that...there is a neat free one Easy Backitup
and put that folder on backup drive. Allow 15 minutes troubleshooting a problem, then restore with image file and bring back data and files and you are back good as new in 20 minutes or less. Sure beats 7 hours reformat and reinstall!

Rich M
www.kickenhardware.net


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Response Number 11
Name: Dragon306
Date: July 2, 2005 at 11:18:09 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

whats wrog with Spyware doctor, registy mechanic, and pc bug doctor? spyware doctor finds stuff that even spybot-s&d misses, pc bug doctor corrects invalid shortcuts and invalid CLSID, and regisrty mechanic cleans out the windows registry, including add/remove programs, software locations, deep invalid entries, etc. it sems like a great program, and what the heck is wrong with Symantec Norton Anitvirus??


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Response Number 12
Name: robertj
Date: July 2, 2005 at 16:50:40 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

Try acronis,Nothing like this program.


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Response Number 13
Name: justasking
Date: July 2, 2005 at 19:34:01 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

ok, let me explain: the reason i don't know the speed of the dell is because iv'e only been using it for 2 days, and i don't own it (i would never buy a dell.

i just defragmented my HD a few days ago... and that's what i meant. i think some of my core windows programs might be clogged, i don't know why (my system is a survivor of a norton AV intallation, and uninstall - i had to manually edit and delete a lot of the garbage that norton left behind. now i use NOD32)

what is even stranger is that my windows x64 installation is SLOWER than my 32 bit installation (as iv'e read before).

and jam, can you find me a better powered up laptop than the compaq x6000 for that price? i'd be glad to know - i'm not exactly interested in paying $2500 for something sager or alienware - my system costed ~1700


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Response Number 14
Name: Rich Mentzel
Date: July 2, 2005 at 20:52:22 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

Dragon 306,
Those programs are not on my recommended list without going any further,and they should not be on yours if you have to reformat every 3 months.
I never get any spyware so Spybot never has anything to do with Spywareblaster onboard. Win Patrol stops every internal interference...and it is a personal opinion but I think Norton Antivirus is the most ineffective antivirus program going. It almost never can clean a file only delete it.
It is like a big can of "sludge" in a pc with all it's resource robbing "eye candy", and it has the poorest track record on worms and Trojans, which are most of the problems today.


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Response Number 15
Name: justasking
Date: July 2, 2005 at 23:45:33 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

hey! all of you are going a bit off track from my original problem: why is my computer slower.

i do tend to believe that my installation may have been damaged and banged up (as i said, i had norton)

firefox is slow, so is microsoft office and IE, and windows media player is also slow to start... seems the only things that go at a normal pace (for a computer like mine) are 3dsmax and photoshop.... whatever - i guess i'll just have to live with it until next format/install (which i plan on doing if i ever get a new HD)


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Response Number 16
Name: quacked
Date: July 11, 2005 at 21:12:01 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

Just a thought to help speed up your computer ,,, Have you reset your paging file??? right click my computer > properties> advanced>Performance (settings)>virtual memory change,

This can be set to the same for the minimum and maximum at 1.5 times the amount of ram that is installed ,,,, this helps prevent disk thrashing and a changing pagefile size

there are other settings there also to enhance performance...

Also you might try clearing your prefetch folder...

At the moment I've forgotten how to adjust and do it,,, I'll look into it again and if someone hasn't posted by then I'll try again


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Response Number 17
Name: StuartS
Date: July 11, 2005 at 22:02:00 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

Quacked if we were talking about Windows 98 your advice would have some relevance. But as this is a Windwos XP question it has no relevance.

Windows XP manages memory differently than Windows 98 and so the concept of a fixed page file size is irrelevant. Thrashing only occurs when there is insufficient real memory for the tasks being performed and stuff is constantly being swapped in and out of virtual memory.

Windows starts of with a page file size of 1.5 times memory and then adjusts it according to what the computer is doing. In most circumstances it adjusts it downwards.

Stuart


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Response Number 18
Name: jam14online
Date: July 12, 2005 at 12:32:52 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

With all of this fuss, you could've backed up essential files, reinstalled and had that machine fresh-as-oranges by now!

I've always found problems lie in one of three areas:

1. The hardware itself
2. The Windows registry
3. Malware

I recommend checking the SMART health status of the hard drive, running a complete memory test with memtest86 and then running something like SiSoft Sandra with it's full-whack benchmark mode. That'll stress-test just about every component. If it's not the hardware, onto the next possibility...

...the Windows registry. After a hell of a lot of debating and shouting over the past few years, I have concluded myself that the registry is a Bad Thing. The "opposite" of the registry is having many configuration files dotted around your hard drive. I would strongly prefer this than having to find out which highly-obscure registry key is ruining your system. This is where much of the *nix platform wins!

Finally, malware. This can be in dozens of different forms: viruses, worms, trojans, spyware, adware, dialers, popups, keyloggers etc. As someone has already mentioned, NOD32 is the best anti-virus, hands down. For a firewall, you're probably best served by a decent hardware one at your router. Anyway, I'll try not to diverge any more.

Basically, if you've scoured that system for malware using tools mentioned and widely available and your hardware cannot be faulted, I'd just suggest a reinstall. You'll quickly see thereafter if it really was the OS's fault.

In fact, you could just find a spare hard drive, connnect it up and disconnect the current one temporarily. Then install Windows XP on it. Then compare.


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Response Number 19
Name: justasking
Date: July 12, 2005 at 21:21:46 Pacific
Reply: (edit)

thanks for all the advice... iv'e formatted and un-installed - but it's still a bit choppy (the installation was a bit rocky)

i plan to buy a 7200 HD - i saw one in action on a laptop over a year old - and i noticed enhanced performance in some areas)

Compaq X6000 Notebook
Pentium 4 630HT 3.0 Ghz
1.5 GB DDR2 PC4200533 RAM
ATI Mobility Radeon x600 128MB
1440x900 - "17 LCD
XP-SP2/XPx64


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