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Extracting / BSOD

Original Message
Name: paradoxwizard
Date: May 15, 2008 at 01:17:28 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
OS: Windows XP SP2
CPU/Ram: P4, 2.8Ghz/640MB
Model/Manufacturer: Intel Pentium
Comment:
Hello again,

I recently swap my HDD from an old computer (1.5Ghz) to an improved one (2.8Ghz) as some of you may remember:
http://www.computing.net/answers/ha...

I installed a fresh copy of Microsoft Windows XP SP2 but ever since I get all these BSOD (Blue screen of death) and most of them, after a short google trip, are related to my RAM.

I got "page fault in non page fault", and "Bad Pool Caller" and sometimes even a suprise reboot. After I installed a different copy of Windows, just when I was about to finish my work and have all the hardware and software installed, it happened once more but this time is happened seldom.

Another annoying problem is that every file I download, when extracting I get an error.
I thought maybe it's a specific problem with a specific file but it happens, for example, when I try to install Adobe Acrobat Reader or Avast! Anti-Virus. Each time I extract a file I get a message that the file is corrupted. Happens with Office 2007 too.

I tried installing the exact files on my other computer and it works wonderfully.

Details:
Intel Pentium 4 2.8Ghz, 640MB of RAM
2 HDD, DVD-Burner.
IDE Channel 0 is connected to the 2 HDDs, one Master and the other one is Slave.
IDE Channel 0 is connected to the DVD-Burner as Master.

I'm really frustrated and thinking about calling an "undo" to this all operation and just get my old computer back.

Can you help me?

Why souldn't I post a question here? Oh, because some people might think it's part of the message. Right?


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Response Number 1
Name: paradoxwizard
Date: May 15, 2008 at 01:19:14 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
Sorry*:

IDE Channel 1 is connected to the DVD-Burner as Master.*

Why souldn't I post a question here? Oh, because some people might think it's part of the message. Right?


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Response Number 2
Name: Razor2.3
Date: May 15, 2008 at 01:30:56 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
Sounds like bad RAM to me. Run a test on it. I suggest Memtest86+.

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Response Number 3
Name: paradoxwizard
Date: May 15, 2008 at 02:49:36 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
Thanks for your response.

I'm having a check-up and so far Memtest 86+ found 3 errors which I will provide details about when complete.

I can buy new RAM, about 1GB, not that expensive, 100NIS (about 30$) but I want to be sure that this will rectify the situation, especially with the extract problem.

Why souldn't I post a question here? Oh, because some people might think it's part of the message. Right?


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Response Number 4
Name: Razor2.3
Date: May 15, 2008 at 02:57:31 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
Probably. I've heard of bad PSU's causing memory errors, but I've never seen it myself. It could also be an issue with the motherboard, but typically, it's the RAM.

The test would be to do multiple passes. If the same errors pop up around the same addresses, then I'd swap in a new RAM chip or two.


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Response Number 5
Name: paradoxwizard
Date: May 15, 2008 at 03:32:53 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
Had ran the test 6 times.

Here are the results:

http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/...

Why souldn't I post a question here? Oh, because some people might think it's part of the message. Right?


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Response Number 6
Name: Razor2.3
Date: May 15, 2008 at 04:15:08 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
The addresses are kinda random, but it's odd that the error is in the exact same spot in the block.

A better option would be to swap RAM with a working PC, but this would require access to a PC that takes the same type of RAM. If that's not an option, try getting a stick of cheap/replacement RAM and testing again.


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Response Number 7
Name: paradoxwizard
Date: May 15, 2008 at 06:23:49 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
Okay, definitely RAM problem.

I opened-up my computer and took the RAM out of the slots, cleaned it a bit then replaced one for another only that Windows won't boot so I changed it back.

Turned the computer back on again and I checked with Memtest86+. This time it found "No Errors", I also tried to extract files from Avast! and Acrobat Reader and it seemed to work great.

Picture:
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/...

Question is -- Should I get myself a new pair of RAM or will this current situation last?

Why souldn't I post a question here? Oh, because some people might think it's part of the message. Right?


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Response Number 8
Name: OtheHill
Date: May 15, 2008 at 07:24:26 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
Don't fix what ain't broke. You can always get RAM later. The contacts may have just been oxidized and the mechanical action of moving the RAM around may have scrubbed off the oxidation.

Did you install the MBoard chipset and integrated hardware drivers after re-installing Windows?


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Response Number 9
Name: paradoxwizard
Date: May 15, 2008 at 08:33:29 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
Damn it!

I restarted my computer and performed aother scan, but Memtest86+ found errors.

I don't know about the chipset, but I installed everything with the original disk (Sound, Sata etc.)

I don't think there's room to doubt it's a RAM-related problem, right?

Why souldn't I post a question here? Oh, because some people might think it's part of the message. Right?


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Response Number 10
Name: Razor2.3
Date: May 15, 2008 at 09:25:26 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
It sounds like something's failing as the system warms up. I'd say there's about 80% chance it's the RAM.

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Response Number 11
Name: Tubesandwires
Date: May 15, 2008 at 09:50:17 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
Ram that works in another mboard , or any ram you buy or have lying around, may not work properly, or sometimes, not at all - even if it physically fits and is the right overall type (e.g. SDram, DDR, DDR2, etc.; PCxxxx, xxx mhz) for your mboard. In the worst cases of incompatibilty your mboard WILL NOT BOOT with it installed, and the mboard may not even beep - the ram has to be compatible with the mboard and it's chipset.

See response 5 in this for some info about ram compatibilty, and some places where you can find out what will work in your mboard for sure:
http://www.computing.net/hardware/w...
Correction to that:
Mushkin www.mushkin.com

Once you know which module ID strings work in your mboard, you can get them from anywhere you like that has ram with those ID strings.
.....

A common thing that can happen with ram, even ram that worked fine previously, is the ram has, or has developed, a poor connection in it's slot(s).
This usually happens a long time after the ram was installed, but it can happen with new ram, or after moving the computer case from one place to another, and I've had even new modules that needed to have their contacts cleaned.

See response 2 in this - try cleaning the contacts on the ram modules, and making sure the modules are properly seated:
http://www.computing.net/hardware/w...

For a laptop, you must remove both its main battery and AC adapter before you do that.

If you do a ram test, do that AFTER having tried cleaning the contacts and making sure the ram is seated properly - otherwise any errors found may be FALSE.
If the ram is incompatible with the chipset, it will likely FAIL a ram test - that is NOT a true indication of the ram being faulty - there is probably nothing wrong with it, and it will pass the test if installed in a mboard it is compatible with.
.......

I personaly have recently had PC133 ram where each module tested fine by itself in any ram slot, but when two modules were installed I got many errors when I ran at least one full pass of memtest86.
The errors did not necessarily appear in the same places when I did more than one pass, and some passes produced more errors than others, and the number of errors varied depending on which module was in which slot.
When I stopped using one of the modules and used another module along with one I already had, I got no ram errors at all.


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Response Number 12
Name: paradoxwizard
Date: May 15, 2008 at 12:27:10 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
Thank you for all this input.

I took my computer to a licensed technician. Took a strange look at me and said we better take cover before it will explode.

Someone disabled the fan, and the computer reached 60 degrees Celsius when wide open, also he showed me that some parts on the motherboard were about to irrupt and many "swollen" cables. Most of which I didn't know how to tell.

I took everything back to my old computer and the only thing I can point on that this whole operation only led me to have another HDD.

Appriciate all your help,
you're doing a great job!!!

Why souldn't I post a question here? Oh, because some people might think it's part of the message. Right?


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Response Number 13
Name: OtheHill
Date: May 15, 2008 at 13:54:22 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
60 Celsius isn't that hot. I think the place you took it to gave you a snow job. 60C = 140F. That is hot, but not hot enough to damage the MBoard.

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Response Number 14
Name: aegis
Date: May 15, 2008 at 15:38:47 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
I agree with Othehill.

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Response Number 15
Name: Razor2.3
Date: May 16, 2008 at 00:57:55 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
I'd question the validity of anyone who said we needed to fix something because it got hot when we disabled its cooling.

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Response Number 16
Name: paradoxwizard
Date: May 16, 2008 at 02:04:01 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
Either way, some electrical parts/wires of the motherboard did seem to irrupt and said it's not worth the money.

We're old clients and he's a friend of the family, I do trust him and you, of course. I wasn't there in person, just over the phone as my brother took it.

Why souldn't I post a question here? Oh, because some people might think it's part of the message. Right?


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Response Number 17
Name: Tubesandwires
Date: May 16, 2008 at 09:50:08 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
It sounds like the info you got from the technician lost something in translation.

"Someone disabled the fan..."
There is no way the cpu fan can be disabled by user settings.

"....some parts on the motherboard were about to irrupt and many "swollen" cables."

What he may have been talking of is there are failed capacitors on the mboard. That can certainly cause all sorts of strange problems, including ram errors you weren't getting before with ram that was previously working fine.
You don't normally see anything wrong with the wiring on a malfunctioning computer, but sometimes when a capacitor fails or shorts you may see damage to wiring and/or to circuits on the mboard.
If there are bad capacitors and/or if mboard has been damaged, it's quite possible the circuits for the cpu fan were damaged, or the cpu fan motor itself was fried.

Open up your case and examine the mboard to see if you have bad capacitors, and/or other findable signs of mboard damage .

This was the original bad capacitor problem - has some example pictures.
History of why the exploding capacitors and which mboard makers were affected:
http://members.datafast.net.au/~dft...

What to look for, mboard symptoms, example pictures:
http://www.badcaps.net/pages.php?vid=5
Home page that site
- what the problem is caused by
- he says there are STILL bad capacitors on more recent mboards.
http://www.badcaps.net/

Pictures of blown capacitors, other components, damaged mboard circuits, power supplies, Athlon cpu's, etc.:
http://www.halfdone.com/Personal/Jo...
......

Even if the mboard and/or the cpu and/or the cpu fan are damaged, there is probably nothing wrong with your ram and your floppy drive, hard drive(s), and optical drive(s).


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Response Number 18
Name: paradoxwizard
Date: May 18, 2008 at 12:10:20 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
That's pretty much it.

The motherboard had some bad caps like they were about to explode as in the pictures you linked.

Why souldn't I post a question here? Oh, because some people might think it's part of the message. Right?


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Response Number 19
Name: Tubesandwires
Date: May 19, 2008 at 07:06:17 Pacific
Subject: Extracting / BSOD
Reply: (edit)
OK
That makes sense.
The ram is probably fine in that case and should work ok when installed in a mboard it is compatible with.

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