I'm putting together a system w/ecs kt600-A board and for the life of me I can't get it to boot with my Radeon 9500 or 9200?

I've installed all board drivers, at least I assume I have as there are no problems in Device manager with the exception of the sound driver that I just haven't taken the time to download yet. My last board (k7n8xdelux) recently caught fire and I have a suspicion the 9500 that was installed in it is still fine, but just to be sure I tried and older 9200 that I know works, but nothing. I get one beep and no text. I put in and old 4x geforce and it boots fine.

Any ideas? Thanks :-)

I'd like to hear the story about how your old board caught fire...lol

LOL, well, it really wasn't a big deal, but the potential for catching my house on fire did concern me a bit.

It was in sleep mode and I woke up that morning and noticed it was off, I thought that odd, but it's a PC so anything can happen. I pressed the start button and notice some light down there that I never noticed before, walked around and looked in the case and the corner of the board was flaming. I was able to blow it out no problem. I would guess that the short kicked off the power supply while I slept and it reset itself before I woke and when I started it again, it finished it off.

I'm now very leary about leaving one running when I'm a sleep or not there. I had the MBM alarm set, but it never went off. CPU was still good so that explains that. Not sure I could have done anything to prevent it.

My first thought was "this is the last ASUS I buy" but one thing in their favor was the board survived a lightning strike that took out the CPU and modem a couple of years prior so, that could have something to do with it, but maybe not. I'll still give them the benefit of the doubt, but unfortunately I had to step down to a cheaper board, I loved that A7N8X. :-(

The real bummer here was the incident happened the day before I went into surgery for a knee replacement. I had all my games set up and was ready to have a great time killing time while stuck in bed, that didn't happen, lol.

My games still await me, but the ol' Geforce just doesn't cut the mustard. Hope someone comes along to help me here so I don't have to return this board.

At this rate, I'll be up and running before the PC is.

Check the mboard manual to see what it says about 2X AGP and/or AGP cards that require 3.3 volts. The 9200 for sure, and maybe the 9500, have backward support built into the ATI chipset for 2X AGP which requires 3.3 volts in the AGP slot, whether it is obvious in specs for the card or not (see the ATI site for the true full chipset specs if it's a clone card). Some mboard chipsets/AGP slots that are 4X or 4X/8X AGP will not work with a video card that supports 2X AGP / 3.3 volts and may even be damaged when you install such a card in a AGP slot in short time. A few 4X or 4X/8X AGP mboards have protection built in and will not boot at all in order to protect the mboard, or won't boot and will light up a special led, when you install a 2X capable card, but those are rare.
9600 and up ATI chipsets have no 2X AGP support for sure.
Your 4X card is probably 4X only.

"I would guess that the short kicked off the power supply while I slept and it reset itself before I woke and when I started it again, it finished it off."

Unless you had the bad capacitor problem, it is a lot more likely the PS was failing and caused the fire and not the other way around.

Examine the mboard to see if you have bad capacitors, and/or other findable signs of mboard damage .

This was the original bad capacitor problem - has some example pictures.
History of why the exploding capacitors and which mboard makers were affected:
http://members.datafast.net.au/~dft...

What to look for, mboard symptoms, example pictures:
http://www.badcaps.net/pages.php?vid=5
Home page that site
- what the problem is caused by
- he says there are STILL bad capacitors on more recent mboards.
- links on left to economical available premade or custom capacitor kits, and/or you can ship the mboard to him and he will replace the capacitors for a flat $45 fee (including the capacitors) plus $15 shipping, and up (North America only).
http://www.badcaps.net/

Pictures of blown capacitors, other components, power supplies, Athlon cpu's, etc.:
http://www.halfdone.com/Personal/Jo...

"Unless you had the bad capacitor problem, it is a lot more likely the PS was failing and caused the fire and not the other way around."

Interesting post, Tube, I did try the power supply afterwards and it did "seem" to work, but to avoid confusion I went to a another known good PSU so, the one in question could be bad. I'll look in to the rest of your post later as I am interested in the problem. It was just burnt in the upper right very corner as it sits in the case. I could, (yes stupidly) pinch the burnt spot and the fan would come back on but no boot. The power light on the board still works.
**********************************

I think you hit the nail on the head as far as the voltage being wrong in the Radeon and it not working on that board. I'll have to recheck the manual, but I'm nearly sure it said the AGP supports only 1.5 volt. You sound pretty sure about the over 3 volts on the Radeon so, again, I'd say you are right.

So the next question would be a matter of what should I expect from the vendor (Ebay seller) I would guess that technically I have no ground to stand on if the voltage was mentioned in the listing and even if it wasn't I assume it my responsibility to check the manual to see before hand if the board is compatible with my card. An easy mistake to make, but my fault I presume.

Now on the other hand, if the add just stated that the board supported 8X, I may sorta be within my right to expect them to take it back. I'm reasonably sure Ebay rules state that any info beyond the actual description page is unenforceable. I'll have to see on that. Either way, I could send it back and Ebay would force a refund, I've done it many times before, but I just don't want to be unfair to the seller.

Thanks so much, I'll check a few things but problem most likely solved and my days of percecete and care free gaming will have to wait a bit longer.

I just checked the Specs and all indications are the cards should work. On the 9200 it does mention the 3.3volt but that is for 2X applications. The 4X and 8X are 1.5 and 0.8 v and the board supports. This is all on the 9200, but I'm guessing the 9500 is the same.

Of course there could be something I'm not understanding here and if so, Tube, could you please explain?

If y'all could please take a look at the specs here on the 92 and 9500 (I could only find specs for the 9500 Pro) and tell me if they agree those cards should work?

http://ati.amd.com/products/radeon9...

http://ati.de/products/radeon9500/r...

Thanks

Check your old PS.
See response 4 in this:
http://www.computing.net/hardware/w...

Ads often state only the max AGP speed.
Clone card makers also often don't state the lesser AGP capabilities in specs, or on the boxes the card comes in. If the Ebay seller was going by clone card maker's specs he or she may not have been aware of lesser AGP capability because that wasn't mentioned in specs; if the Ebay seller was selling an ATI brand (made by ATI) card the lesser AGP capability info is easily found on the ATI site if not on the box it came in and they should have known better.

When I mentioned the "Ebay seller" I was talking about the seller of the motherboard and it's AGP compatibility. I've had the Radeon's around for a year or two.

Tube, did you check the specs I linked too and does it appear the cards should work to you?

Here is a C/P of what the board manual states on it's AGP voltage:

"The KT600-A provides four 32-bit PCI slots, an AGP slot (supports
1.5V AGP card only) and CNR (Communications and
Networking Rise slot."

I know with absolute certainty the 9200 chipset supports 2X because I researched it previously.
The problem with 4X only and 4X/8X only (it says 1.5V AGP card only in your specs) AGP mboards is caused because the 2X / 3.3 volt support is wired up to the contacts on the card, whether you can even use, or do choose to use, the 2X support or not.
The 9200 definately cannot work with such mboards.

There is less info on the ATI website than when I last looked. The 9500 chipset specs are a bit muddy, but I suspect the same thing applies.
I know of no other reason it won't work.
From the specs:
"Intel® Pentium® 4/III/II/Celeron™, AMD® K6/Duron™/Athlon®/Athlon® XP or compatible with AGP 8X/4X/2X slot"

Yours is a 4X or a 4X/8X AGP (1.5V AGP card only) slot.
The physical slot design is universal 8X/4X/2X, but the mboard doesn't support 2X /3.3v capability.

The 9500 box says AGP 4X/8X, but that isn't
aways the whole specs these days.

From the FAQ for 9500:
http://ati.amd.com/products/radeon9...

"Q9: Is there a PCI version of Radeon™ 9700 and/or Radeon™ 9500 Series graphics cards?


A9: Radeon™ 9700 and Radeon™ 9500 Series graphics cards are only available in the Universal AGP 3.0 bus configuration (2X/4X/8X)."

Some mboards, most if not all newer ones, are ONLY 4X or 4X/8X; some, most if not all older ones, are 2X/4X or 2X/4X/8X.

OK, I'll just take your word for it, Tube. To be honest I don't quite understand what you are talking, just too many numbers. I could if I really got into it, but thank goodness I have you to help so I don't have to, lol

I just finished up with ECS and they say it should work and the slot must be bad, but I would guess, that is just what they would claim and in a sense they are correct, for all intents and purposes, the slot IS bad.

I am no longer concerned with the moral issue of if I should return the board ore not, it's going back to the seller. If he's going to sell questionable hardware where there is actually some of what I would call sneaky/unspoken stuff going on, he's just going to have to expect this.

I've read where others have the Radeon cards working with the board but have tons of trouble with the Via CS so....

For some reason the CMOS only mentions 2X4X and no 8X, but never mind, lol, I promised myself I wouldn't beat my brains out trying to understand it.

Anyway, Tube, from what I gather from your post, would I be correct in assuming I will be fairly sure of Radeon compatibility if I replace the MB with a 4X or 4X8X? Or should I just stay away from the ECS? Thanks again for the input, I'd be lost with out it.

FWIW, here id what ECS insists after I gave them a link to this thread:

"ECS Support(USA) Posted : GMT 2007/12/27 21:12:07
We sorry that We do not understand what you are referring to
The AGP solt on the board will support on the 4X 8X AGP card that does not have any issue your outdated ATI VGA card."

I did a bit of looking around.
ECS is right - the 9200 should work - the KT600 chipset will work with 2X/4X or 2X/4X/8X cards.
I have an Asus A7V600 mboard I got recently in exchange for helping a friend upgrade her mboard, etc. - it has the Via KT600 chipset.
I have a ECS 9200 Rex video card in it - it works fine, at 8X, the max the mboard will handle. I confirmed it supports 2X/4X/8X before I bought it, because I wanted the option of using it in 2X only AGP slots.
So, if you have the same KT600 chipset, your mboard should support a 9200 too.
The Asus manual, too, says the slot supports only 1.5v cards, but what I forgot the critical thing it DOESN'T say, just like yours probably DOESN'T say, is a 2X/3.3 volt card will harm the mboard.

As for the 9500 card, it should work too.

Possible reasons they don't work?

Some video cards can be overclocked by upping the AGP voltage a bit, some won't tolerate that. Take a look in the bios Setup and make sure the AGP slot is using 1.5v and not something higher than that (on my Asus mboard that can be set to up to 1.7 v).

Some cards will tolerate overclocking by other means, some won't. If you are overclocking the bus speed, try setting it to a standard setting instead.

This Asus A7V600 mboard has a jumper that can be used for overclocking by means of increasing the cpu voltage - the increase does not show up in the current voltage readings in the bios Setup. When I first set up the mboard for her (it had a Sapphire 9600XT card in it at the time), I couldn't figure out at first why the cpu temp was higher than it should have been. When I discovered the jumper was in the overclocked position and moved it back to the normal position, the cpu temp dropped 10 degrees C or more.
If your mboard has such a jumper, make sure it is in the normal position - other voltages such as the AGP voltage could be increased by it as well.

If none of that applies, a buggy bios version?
I don't recommend updating the bios unless a fix for the problem you are having is mentioned in the release notes for a bios version, or you can use any bios version newer than that since usually all previous fixes are included in a newer bios updates.

Many ECS mboards are actually made by Hsing Tech, not ECS. Hsing Tech does not sell their mboards under the Hsing Tech brand, but retails their mboards under the PCChips brand, and also sells their mboards OEM to other vendors such as ECS.
Hsing Tech / PCChips mboards have a reputation of using the absolute cheapest bios flash chips they can, and those flash chips are well known to physically fail while flashing more often than average.
If the mboard is actually made by Hsing Tech, you will probably find the manual is generic - it has no mention of ECS or Hsing Tech in it.

A damaged AGP slot and/or it's circuits, or a damaged card.
The most common reason for that is someone did not remove the AC power to the PS connected to the mboard when removing or installing the card. AGP is particularly vulnerable - contacts on the card and in the slot are staggered and in two vertical rows on each side - ATX mboards are always powered in some places including some contacts in the AGP slot as long as live AC is being supplied to the PS, even when Windows is Shut Down or in Standby or Hibernate modes, and even when there is no hard drive installed - removing or installing the card when the PS is getting live AC can easily damage the AGP slot and/or it's circuits, and/or damage the card.
Take a look at the AGP slot contacts, and the card contacts, using good lighting, and a magnifying glass if you need to - there should be no damaged contacts. On the other hand, there may be no visible damage yet the circuits are damaged.

In a tiny number of cases, a particular card or card chipset may not work in a particular mboard no matter what you do. That doesn't explain why both the 9200 and 9500 don't work though. Try it in another mboard.

Wow, again I am in your debt, tube and thanks.

I have a lexicon Core 2 duplex home recording sound card that for some reason the company never updated the drivers. Now I can solve the problem of it only working on Windows 98, but it will also only run on a Pentium 3 with the exception of a few chip sets on AMD boards.

It runs great on the via and did with this board so I came back here with hopes to hear just what you told me. ECS kept insisting and nearly convinced me, but not quite.

I'm now convinced I'll be Ok in getting another. Thanks again for doing the research and I'm off to order another.

One more question, I want to buy new from now on and always buy on Ebay.

I was just wondering if someone could direct me to somewhere that has good prices on new boards and maybe even better prices on multiple boards as I have something else in mind to try and make a few bucks.

I may start another topic on this but want to at least get your opinion while I have you here, Tube. Thanks for yours and any others with suggestion on this.

When you buy mboards on Ebay or from from an ad anywhere on the web, make sure you research the mboard model on the mboard manufacturer's site before you buy it - the infomation in the Ebay ad or other ad may not be complete.

Make sure the ram you buy is going to be compatible with the mboard before you buy it.
See response 5 in this for some info about ram compatibilty, and some places where you can find out what will work in your mboard for sure:
http://www.computing.net/hardware/w...
Correction to that:
Mushkin www.mushkin.com

Some newer mboard chipsets, particularly NVidia ones, cannot work with older operating systems (certainly ME and previous) - that fact is usually clearly stated in the manufacturer's specs and/or in manufacturer's info about the mboard - some have no problem with them - e.g. most current AMD and Via chipsets.
If need be you could dual boot a mboard with a chipset that can be used with older operating systems in order to use your audio card.

I'm in Canada. I haven't ordered a lot of computer related stuff on the web. If you're in the US I'm not the best one to ask where to buy on US sites. A lot of US web sites don't ship to Canada, e.g. newegg, so I don't bother looking at those.
With the exception of the occaisional deal on Ebay, I find I can often get just as good or better mboard or ram prices locally, usually from the smaller guys, at least when you take shipping into account when you order from the web.

OK, thanks, and yes, I usually do the research, I hate those little surprises that come after the fact with incompatible hardware. Can get expensive. I wasn't aware of the older OS incompatibility with some CS's, good to know.

I eventually want a dual core, but'll just stick with the 462 board for now as I can't come up with a good enough reason to spend the extra money.

I have a dual boot setup now and am just looking into the SATA stuff, there seems to be some promising advantages there.

Thanks again for everything.

If you want to possibly re-use your components....
The Epox USA site has old stock but new Socket A (462) mboards, but unfortunately their epoxstore is presently having a server problem.
http://www.epox.com/USA/index.asp

The epoxstore link is working now.

Tube, If you're still around, did you happen to notice any of the prices on the old stock, new boards you mentioned? Their site is still messed up, but if they are pretty reasonable, I'll keep trying....Thanks

The epoxstore link at the above site is working right now for me.
The prices are very good - as little as 30% of the original price.
It isn't obvious until you make an order they ship to the US (as expected), and Canada. If you live elsewhere you may be able to make special arrangements if you cantact them (see below).
AND you can order a replacement bios chip already flashed with the latest bios at the same time for only $10.
NOTE that the USA site does not have complete info (e.g. CPU support) and downloads for some models, but the parent site
http://www.epox.com.tw
does - the Taiwan site has always loaded slowly for me.

Some old stock boards have a warranty of only 90 days but you shouldn't be concerned about that - Epox makes high quality boards.
The computer I am typing this on has an Epox MVP3-G5 mboard made in 1999 and it has been excellent - my Dad is using a slightly older Epox MVP3 model.
I have never come across a mention of an Epox mboard having the faulty capacitor problem.
Their manuals are better than average, and sometimes better than any comparable mboard's manual.
You can get a preflashed bios chip for virtually any of their mboards cheaply, even for ancient models - I know of no model that has a soldered in bios chip (e.g. MSI does that sometimes).

In the last few days I installed a recent Epox mboard - AD580XR - (Cost? $80; + ~$30 shipping if you're in the US; ~ double that for Canada because of extra UPS charges once it crosses the border, and GST) that I purchased at that Epox store about three weeks back. I am very impressed - no other AM2 mboard has all the features this mboard does. Recent AMD/ATI 580 chipset, dual PCI-E 16 , Crossfire support, full ATX size and loaded with all the optional components mentioned in it's manual. Two IDE headers/controllers instead of the one almost all other AM2 mboards have, THREE PCI ports (others often have one or two; commonly for both NVidia and AMD chipsets the first one shares the same IRQ as the second PCI-E X16 slot - you can't use both slots at the same time), TEN USB ports available, SIX SATA headers/ controllers; TWO com ports (one via a header), parallel port (which some AM2 boards don't have any of), and several other features - the only thing it doesn't have is firewire.
It works fine with an ATI X600 Pro AIW card.
The previous Asus M2N-E SLI mboard I had the same components in DID NOT. Apparently NVidia doesn't care if it's recent chipsets and their drivers don't get along with ATI chipset cards and ATI software (Catalyst cannot work on recent AM2 mboards with NVidia chipsets).

According to posts on the web
- this mboard recognizes a 6000+ (I confirmed that - that's what I'm using) and a 6400+ no problem.
- it also works fine with NVidia chipset video cards, though obviously dual NVidia cards are not be supported the same way as on NVidia chipset mboards Crossfire vs SLI).
Most people only install one card in any case.

On top of that, because the AMD/ATI chipset uses a lot of Standard drivers that are built into XP, it booted Windows no problem the first time I tried it, despite the fact Windows was installed when the hd was connected to the M2N-E SLI! No need to run a Repair Setup, which according to perevious experience can cause unforseen problems with XP MCE. The second IDE controller, JMicron, requires drivers be installed, but since Windows was already was installed on the HD all I had to do was install one IDE HD (of two) and one DVD combo drive (of two) on the chipset IDE, use the mboard CD to install the JMicron drivers (and the other mboard drivers), then install the DVD combo drives on the chipset IDE, the hard drives on the JMicron IDE (doesn't recognize optical drives, a common thing with added on IDE controllers), and set the bios to boot from the IDE drive (it defaults to booting a SATA drive, which the system also has but it has no operating system on it, if there is no hard drive connected to the chipset IDE, also common with recent bioses).
No special drivers required for the SATA controllers!
(no drivers required for the first 4 - the other two are connected to the JMicron controller and require the JMicron drivers.)

Email support?
I haven't had much luck with that in the past, but once I made the order and asked them some questions in it, I was contacted inn a short time (but Mon to Fri only). Personal Message me if you want her email address.

Telephone support?
The USA site has a number that works fine, at least for the US and Canada.
1-909-869-0639 (toll free).
(Walnut, California)

hey man i have the same MOBO :D to be honest its really reliable the only downside is that you cant change the multiplier and since the pci isn't locked u cant change the frequency much either... but your problem sounds like you didn't change the agp to 8x in the bios. it didn't automatically activate for me and maybe you are having the same problem. i asume your cards are both 8x? other than your old geforce of corse. so that could be the problem :D if this has already been brought to your attention *i didnt read the previous threads SRY!!!!!!* ,or if you've already tried this, im sry :D but its worth a suggestion right?

yeah dunno this is kinda a tempy acct :P