ok here i am again with some questions...

I went to several computer retailers and most of them advised me to swich from AMD to INTEL, and i've been looking up on the web and it seems that INTEL's core 2 duo Has substancialy better performance than AMD's X2...

Well now to the real question...
I already mentioned my AMD configuration many times in other posts plz go check it out http://www.computing.net/gaming/www...

Now what i am here to ask is basicly a new list replacing AMD with INTEL...and I also would like an advise on my Video card...I am not interested in switching to VISTA so rule out DX 10 cards, I prefer a better performance DX 9 card(PCI-E)...sooo...thats it

Please Repply

[D]ei[M]o[S]

The x1950 Pro is a terrible card. Go with the X1950XT you won't regret it: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...
I want to add that the cooling fan on this unit is extremely loud almost like a small hair dryer on max. So if that bothers you don't get it.

The other alternative is to get this unit and see what the fan sounds like: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...

From reading your previous post this is the closest Core 2 Duo that matches your budget of $80 for the 4200: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...

EVGA, they make good video cards: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...

There is no loser between these two:

Performance per $$$$ = AMD

Performance per Watt = Intel

If you want a literally & figuratively *cooler* system go with Intel. But if you're after the best bang for your buck, you best go with AMD.

For example, Newegg right now, has the retail X2 6000+ at $170.00 shipped to your door. If this was a year ago - a CPU of that caliber will set you back close to $1000. Although Intel has another round of CPU price slashes scheduled within the next two weeks to counter AMD's pre-emptive move. Will that pending implementation be strong enough to dramatically affect any plan to go with AMD .... who knows!

How does a 1.8Ghz Core 2 Duo Intel stomp all over a 2.6Ghz Athlon 5200 for relatively the same price? The benchmarks show that they don't. All those detailed benchmarks start coming to life as you rise in speed up the Core 2 Duo line eventually winning over AMD, but you'll end up spending more money than you'd like before Intel starts beating AMD in the detailed benchmarks.

They are always launching new stuff...

I have no idea of what i wana do...
Tell me, from your personal experince what do you think is the better(or maybe even the parts you use)

By the way can you tell me a good Nvidia Video card, and tell me if you think Nvidia better than ATI...

PS:My budjet for the processor is about 160 $, and for the video card its the same...im not sure what the parts' prices are cuz im buying them in brazil

[D]ei[M]o[S]

"They are always launching new stuff..."

All the more reason why you should never opt for bleeding egde hardware unless you are a pathological sucker. Knowing your level on the hardware food chain & timing your upgrades accordingly could save you literally 100s of $$$' whenever you pull the trigger on your PC builds.

At the present time, my suggestion based on your budget would be the X2 6000+ & the TForce TF7025-M2, coupled with a DX10 card like the 8600GTS since you are building a completely new rig. The only concern (if at all) is that YMMV because you are purchasing the components in Brazil.

I think in Brasil it might be even cheaper cuz their money is the real and its much less valuable than the € or the $...

Anyways, the other components you didnt sugest, Memory, Power Supply, Hard Drive should they stay the same as i originaly posted in my other thread?

Another question is what is "SLI", beacuse in the reviews for the Video Card one guy said this
"A very very fast video card especially in SLI"

And By the Way can yu sugest me a sound card? Im not willing to spend much on that component but i wana hear my game's sounds
[D]ei[M]o[S]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scalab...
The mobo is an SLI version and has two PCI-E ports.

I've been checking the brazilian prices and they are high, very high...

So, i have an uncle that is going to thailand so il buy the parts there, now, i cant find that mobo in any thailand computer retalier sites, il give you the site and can you see what components can yo recomend me from there...

http://www.thanni.com/

Please repply

[D]ei[M]o[S]

All the AMD X2 CPUs from that site do not have as much L2 as I would recommend & the highest X2 they also seem to stock is the 4800+.

Although they have a wider high end CPU selection when it comes to Intel CPUs - I guess there is more of a demand for Intel CPUs in Thailand than there is for AMDs.

If you are going to shop there - you might think about switching to Intel or you can either look for another outlet altogether .... back to you!

Well, maybe can you sugest me an alternative config for intel?

PS: i checked other Thailand sites and the (few) that had the AMD ATHLON X2 6000 was selling it for like 400$

[D]ei[M]o[S]

Even though the X2 6000+ cost almost 60% less over here than it does in Thailand -- the irony of it all is that, those CPUs are assembled in Malaysia; which is right across from Thailand .... LOL

It looks like it might even be cheaper for you to order the parts from here & have it shipped to you in Brazil ... I don't know. I think Frys Outpost & eWiz offer international shipping; although their components are not the most aggressively priced.

You should research that in addition to other retailers from countries nearby, or even a U.S. forwarding service or the possibility of a friend or acquaintance from here; who may be willing to help you with the purchase, shipping & handling.

I'll check out eWiz & plug in some components from AMD & Intel & post back later.

i've been checking out eWiz and their shipping prices seem resonable(maybe i could even ship directly to Portugal) but anyway i think shiping the processor would pay up but i think the rest i should buy in thailand, it might get cheaper, il check it out...what do you think?

Ahh yes and dont forget that intel config i asked you for ok?

[D]ei[M]o[S]

Almost forgot I promised to post back. What I did was go by your earlier listing & just modifying that a little bit.

CPU: AMD X2 5600+(89W) 2.8GHz 2x1MB L2 (AM2) or X2 6000+(125W) 3.0GHz 2x1MB L2

You could probably just get the 5600+ @ $152 & overclock it by 200MHz to get more or less a 6000+ which is faster than a stock ($190.00) E6420 from Intel. Although the E6420 overclocks much better & will easily outpace even the X2 6000+ with very little tweaking on your part.

MB: ASUS M2N-E Socket AM2 NVIDIA nForce 570 Ultra MCP ATX AMD Motherboard

Video Card: 8600GTS 256MB GDDR3 PCI-e x16

Memory: GeIL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory

HD: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3320620AS (Perpendicular Recording Technology) 320GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive

If you will go with Intel. Go with the E6420 & possibly an MSI P35 Neo-F or something equally decent - I selected them exclusively fron eWiz.

Good luck!

Hum...but what do YOU recomend me to do? go with intel or AMD?(performance speaking)

If i buy an GeForce 8800 in thanni it costs me 339$
here are the specs:
Chipset/Core Speed: nVIDIA GeForce 8800GTS/550MHz
Stream Processors: 96
Memory/Effective Speed: 320MB GDDR3/1800MHz
Memory Interface: 320-bit
Interface: PCI-Express x16
Ports: Dual DVI + TV/S-Video/Composite Out
Support 3D API: DirectX 10, OpenGL 2.0
SLI Supported: Yes
Max Resolution: 2560x1600
RAMDACs: 400MHz
Features: Vista Ready, DirectX 10.0 and Shader Mode 4.0, GigaThread Technology, nVIDIA Quantum Effects Technology
Warranty: 2 Years
Package: Retail

Do you think its a good deal?

by the way the Intel mobo you "gave" me doesnt supports SLI, i would like it to, cuz i might buy a second video card someday can you see if you can find me one?

[D]ei[M]o[S]

Intel performs better in detailed benchmarks as the speed goes higher, but AMD's CPUs such as the 5600 & 6000 still are better when compared to the Core 2 Duos that are around the 2.2Ghz mark and below because the higher the speed the better sometimes. The 5600 is not a happy overclocker so don't plan on doing it. You can overclock it to around 3Ghz but it isn't stable sometimes for example when playing games. It really doesn't overclock past 3Ghz either, so you'd have to get the 6000 and overclock it to 3.2Ghz.

Here are the 8800GTS 320MB cards in the U.S.: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...

Here is an SLI mobo for Intel: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...

I can't quite recommend a PSU for you simply because I don't know what case you're going with in order to fit you with one out of the many sizes. Never use the PSU that comes with the case unless it's a reputable PSU. You're going to want a 600W+ unit to power your Intel or 5600 system. For a 6000 system you're going to need a 700W+ unit and another mobo recommendation.

"Hum...but what do YOU recomend me to do? go with intel or AMD?(performance speaking"

I thought this was a no-brainer. Of course Intel offers the better performing CPU in the grand scheme of things. AMD only comes into the picture when you start to deliberate between middle to mid-low selection of CPUs for this build.

As I stated much earlier, knowing your level on the hardware food chain & making your purchase accordingly is perhaps the most crucial thing. If you are trying to stretch your dollar - get an X2 5600+ & stick with the max overclock you can squeeze out of it. That will maximize your savings.

As far as SLI goes .... it is not my thing because it is not a cost efficient exercise: no matter how you look at it. But the turn of events lately is increasingly making it easier to leave that option open - since many SLI motherboards are no more expensive than their non-SLI counterparts.

If you want an SLI motherboard, by all means go for it. If later down the road you do indeed use the feature .... good for you. If you don't then you may not have lost anything insofar as the initial cost of that extra feature is truly inconsequential.

Now go build your AMD system!

I Will!!

here's the (semi)final List!!

Processor: AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual-Core 5200+ 2.6 Ghz-131$
====///=====
Memory:STT DDR2-800 2GB (2x1GB) CL5 S-RIGID
====///=====
HD:Seagate ST3320620A 320GB ATA100 7200rpm 16MB Hard Drive
====///=====
Motherboard:Asus M2N-E SLI Socket AM2/ nForce 500 SLI/ DDR2/ SATA2/ IEEE1394/ A&GbE/ ATX
====///=====
Video Card: Asus nVidia GeForce 8800GTS 640MB 2DVI/HDTV PCI-Express
====///=====
Comments:
Processor - eWiz didnt had AMD athlon x2 5600 & i checked fry's and their 5600 was 190$ I supose that +60$ for + 200Mhz doesent pay up but plz tell me if you agree besides if i did bought at frys i would have to pay more shipping cuz im buying all from eWiz.
===//===
Memory - Not sure if its equivalent to the GeIl's memory...you tell me...
===//===
HD - no comments here...
===//===
MotherBoard - here's the SLI ready MotherBoard, as you said its not more expensive than a non-SLI ready so i think its worth it...
===//===
Video Card: ok, First thing im not sure if i can incresse my budget this much(+400$). If i cant il just buy one 8600GTS
But, suposing i do, what whould be best 2 geForce 8600GRS(SLI^.^) or only this one?

I guess this i all

Plz repply

[D]ei[M]o[S]

The 5200+ is not bad .... just make sure you get the F3 -- ADO5200CZBOX -- stepping if you can.

Forget SLI for now, unless you are buying two 8800GTXs right at this moment. If you want to spend a little more on the video card get an 8800GTS 320MB. But if you want a modest DX10 card, stick with the 8600GTS.

Finally, you don't need DDR2-800 RAM, your CPU ain't gonna scale that high even if overclocked. At the max, some CAS 4 (DDR2-533) is good enough, although there seem to be only a $5.00 difference between 2 x 1GB sticks for the two types of memory - so if you want it, get it - but you certainly don't need it.

Sorry, but i didnt understod this part:
"The 5200+ is not bad .... just make sure you get the F3 -- ADO5200CZBOX -- stepping if you can."

What do you mean by stepping?

[D]ei[M]o[S]

"What do you mean by stepping?"

http://www.techpowerup.com/articles...

Use this to help with your AMD CPU selection:

http://www.amdcompare.com/us-en/des...

So, stepping is a software update for processors?

And...about the processor, you just said 5200 was not bad but is the 5400 or 5600 performance, substancialy, superior?

Since im here il give you links to all of the parts:
Processor: https://www.ewiz.com/desc.php?name=A64-54CZBX
HD:
https://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?name=HD-ST320B
Mobo:
https://www.ewiz.com/desc.php?name=MB-M2NESLI
Memory:
https://www.ewiz.com/desc.php?name=T8UX2GC5
video Card:
https://www.ewiz.com/desc.php?name=EV-88_32MB

"So, stepping is a software update for processors?"

NO, it's NOT software! Didn't you check the link? Maybe if 'stepping' was referred to as 'revision' it would make more sense to you? There are currently two steppings for the 5200+. F2 runs at 89W, F3 runs at 65W. It should be obvious that getting the newer revision/lower wattage CPU would be the better choice.

It makes sense to stay away from the 6000+ 125W CPU, but the 5400+ is available as an 89W CPU only. You'd be better off getting the 65W 5200+ (which will save you about $38), then overclocking it. But make sure to get the right one...eWiz's description about the 'A64-52CZBX' is incorrect. It's the 65W version (F3 stepping), not the 89W version as listed:

http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?name...

http://www.amdcompare.com/us-en/des...

I'd go with Kingston over STT on the RAM. eWiz has this CL4 DDR2-533. Grab a couple of those for (2 x 1GB) total, instead of the Super Talent sticks.

Secondly, stick with the 5200+, it has twice as much L2 as does the 5400+ & get this - you may be able to even overclock the 5200+ (by 200MHz) to get a 5400+ with twice as much L2. But you can't do anything to increase the L2 size on the 5400+ even if you felt like it.

Oh & BTW. A CPU stepping or revision is not a software update for the CPU because you simply can't do the update yourself. It is done by the manufacturer at their fabrication facility.

Very good point about the L2 cache size...I didn't even consider that.

Il stick with the 5200+ and il save some bucks :)

in terms of Video Card you think its better i go with a 640mbs 8600GTS or with a 320 8600Gts (considering that the 640mbs version is basiclly the double of the 320mbs in price)

[D]ei[M]o[S]

If you are asking about the difference in cost benefit between getting an 8800GTS 320MB vs 8800GTS 640MB. It will depend on the level of detail that you are going to be gaming under.

However, the 320MB is NOT half as fast as the 640MB even though the 640MB cost twice as much. In reality, the performance gap between the two is not as far apart. Furthermore, if you will be playing at sub 1600 x 1200 resolution; that gap is almost completely absent. My suggestion will be to go for the 320MB version.

P.S. I have yet to see an 8600GTS 320MB or 640MB version listed on the web, but if you have - please post the links.

i'l sleep a bout that ;)

[D]ei[M]o[S]

Deimos,

You've been posting for weeks (if not months) about this system you plan on building. Do you do ANY research on your own?

The 8600GT or GTS are OK, but they're not fantastic cards. Have a peak at a few of the reviews:

http://www.legitreviews.com/article...

http://anandtech.com/video/showdoc....

http://www.bjorn3d.com/read.php?cID...

Jam,

Thanks for the usefull links but im planing on getting an 8800GTS 320MB and not an 8600GTS...And yes I think i might be posting for months now...but thats beacause i (consider my self) as a cautious person, and i want to evaluate all of my chances beafore making my final purchase(not to mencion i dont have all the $$$ yet)

Here's the final list:

Asus M2N-E SLI Socket AM2/ nForce 500 SLI/ DDR2/ SATA2/ IEEE1394/ A&GbE/ ATX Motherboard-$86.52

AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual-Core Processor 5200+* (2.6GHz) AM2-$132.87

Kingston D2-533 1G/128x64 Memory D21G533KI-$43.77(2 units)

Seagate ST3320620A 320GB ATA100 7200rpm 16MB Hard Drive-$73.13

EVGA nVidia GeForce 8800GTS Superclocked 320MB 2DVI/HDCP PCI-Express
Video Card-$302.82
Total- $682.88 + $125(shipping)

And i still need a power supply, i dont know how many watts sould it be, i just know it has to be at least 400W to support the Video card.

[D]ei[M]o[S]

http://www.extreme.outervision.com/...
You need 500W+ is what I got.

Specifications

Performance
NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GTS
576 MHz GPU
96 Pixel Pipelines
400 MHz RAMDAC

Memory
320 MB, 320 bit DDR3
1700 MHz (effective)
68 GB/s Memory Bandwidth

Interface
PCI-E 16X
DVI-I, DVI-I, HDTV
SLI Capable

Resolution & Refresh
240 Hz Max Refresh Rate
2048 x 1536 x 32bit x85Hz Max Analog
2560 x 1600 Max Digital

***Requirements***
Minimum of a 400 Watt power supply.

(Minimum recommended power supply with +12 Volt current rating of 26 Amp Amps.)

e-GeForce 8800GTS 320MB Superclocked.

The GTX series on the other hand require -- at minimum -- a bit more power (450W) & also need needs two connections to the PSU, but the GTS requires only one connection.

Certified SLI-Ready Power Supplies.

I'l buy a 500W then...
Now do i need and extra cooler? i mean besides the coller tha comes with the CPU il still need one more?

[D]ei[M]o[S]

I think we need to brace ourselves for when you actually get these components & you are ready to slap it all together ..... LOL

Chassis Cooling Guidelines

Am I asking too many questions?

[D]ei[M]o[S]

I'm sure that's a rhetorical question. Anyhow, I think you are missing the whole point - some questions benefit greatly from sampled opinions, while others could very well be answered by independent research.

Questions are fine insofar as you are not conveying a lack of quality contribution on your part .... see jam's response #28.

So when do you plan on actually ordering these parts anyway .... Thanksgiving; Christmas?

There's PCI coolers. These days all those case fans are really a gimmick. Your GFX card has a cooler, the CPU has a cooler, and the PSU does a nice job at circulating most of the air inside of the case. If you're thinking like an enthusiast, you're going to have at least 1 case sucking air in to replenish the air expelled by the PSU, which should already be included in your case purchase(usually rear or side case fan).

Im planing on ordering them this september.

[D]ei[M]o[S]

is Lc-Power a good power supply brand?

cuz i saw for salle, in Portugal this:
"LC-POWER LC-6550G 550W 2.0 140mm"

And pheraps you can take a look at this case and tell me what you think...

http://www.microcaos.pt/product_inf...

[D]ei[M]o[S]