Anyway, thanks for the help...

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From what I've gathered in the last six months, AMD is really doing a good job with the A64 and Opteron. Not only AMD is getting more into server, it's 64 bits is ahead of Intel. On the other hand, Prescott has forced Intel to rethink in the Gigabite speed. This explains in the new Intel numbering system. I could give many links here. But, if you've already known you wouldn't need them. If you do want the proof, it's all over the websites. I have 7 Intels and 2 AMDs. I like both of them; and I own both of Stocks not just the processors. However, I'd wish I sold Intel three months ago. My next rig is A64 mobile, soley based on performance and a bit on pricing. However, Intel mobile is beginning to show with MB support. Bottom line, this is not the right time to get new rig. Wait two to three months.

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"Why do you want him to explain?" Because he made an unusual (if not outlandish) claim that goes against most ways of evaluating bang for the buck. Yes it is possible to find a poor bang for the buck amd cpu, but in general amd is the better deal

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Yes, AMD will always be the better deal. But in comparing its high performance cpu's, AMD is starting to get a little overboard with prices. AMD wants everyone to look at s939 prices right now and go oh wow, looks like i'll hafta go for a s754. But by the end of the year s754 isnt ganna have much support anymore and AMD is going to make it a value cpu platform for the AthlonXP (Paris). Not to mention another socket for 64-bit AMDs coming out late 2005. With Intel there will be 2 sockets to choose from, one 32-bit s478 and 64-bit s775. And the new chipsets will be ready with PCI-E and soon support DDR2. While AMD is screwing it's customers over by making them have a choice to upgrade to a new 64-bit socket and cpu every friggin year.

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"While AMD is screwing it's customers over by making them have a choice to upgrade to a new 64-bit socket and cpu every friggin year" The socket A was the longest lasting standard of motherboard compatibility in the history of home computers.

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"The socket A was the longest lasting standard of motherboard compatibility in the history of home computers." Key word is was, socket A will become obsolete by the end of the year. right now after looking into it more, it seems an A64 3000 1MBL2 cache and a nforce3 250GB mobo are the best performance for the price right now.

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Okay so if a company provides compatibility year after year after year and then changes, that provokes the conclusion that this company is making me change motherboards every friggin year. I get it now.

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All current socket 754 ( Athlon 64 ) and socket 940 ( Athlon 64 FX ) will be able to fit into the new 939 socket, I think ones AMD goes to socket 939 they will be sticking with it like the old socket A, don't see why people should be complaining about AMD moving sockets, remember the old Athlon was Slot 1 then they moved the Athlon to Socket A, and besides, once AMD move to socket 939, ALL their CPU's will have Dual Channel support, that's why socket 939 Athlon 64 are much more expensive Once I save a bit of money I will be going to socket 939 with a much faster Athlon 64, I think AMD are doing a good job moving the two Athlon 64 and FX processors to 1 socket, plus socket 939 is backwards compatible with socket 754 and 940, well done AMD, if AMD was screwing the customer then they would have made socket 939 and make it only work with just the 939 Athlon 64 ________________________ MSI KT8 NEO Athlon 64 3200+ @ 2.0ghz 1.0 GB DDR PC3200 2X 160 GB HDD Hightech Excalibur Radeon 9800 Pro Iceq 128mb ( Core 425 MHz and Memory 380 MHz )

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I don't mean that AMD hasn't served compatibility year after year with its old Socket A motherboards. But look at whats in store for AMD's cpu roadmap. http://www.c627627.com/AMD/AthlonXP/ Socket754->Socket939->Socket900. So if you buy a A64 now, you might be forced to upgrade to a new motherboard and cpu for the new socket types in a matter of a year.

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"I don't mean that AMD hasn't served compatibility year after year with its old Socket A motherboards. But look at whats in store for AMD's cpu roadmap." What did you mean? "Socket754->Socket939->Socket900. So if you buy a A64 now, you might be forced to upgrade to a new motherboard and cpu for the new socket types in a matter of a year." Why would I be forced to do that? Do some of them self destruct? Skip

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"Why would I be forced to do that? " Excellent point. As though a mobo that can only use one cpu is bad. Come to think of it, I have never upgraded a cpu while keeping the same mobo. Only the opposite. Hm-m-m.

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"All current socket 754 ( Athlon 64 ) and socket 940 ( Athlon 64 FX ) will be able to fit into the new 939 socket" Where did you hear that? Haha ok you won't be forced, but going from 754 to 939 will give you 10-25% performance increase, and 20-80% increase in memory intensive programs.

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LOL we are all suckers. The only thing that decreases faster in value is food. Look this discussion. As interesting as it is, it's just a testiment to how these companies are just releasing technology to us in small doses, and we eat every bit of it up like idiots. About 4 years ago my girlfriend, who was attending south alabama at the time, had a roomate from Japan. Her friends came down to visit her from japan. My GF was on her cell phone which she just got, and it was the newest model at the time, and she was all excited about it. They pulled out this thing that looked like a 2 piece palm pilot, but was the size of a phone, looked like a two sided LCD mini computer. They said it wasn't even a "expensive model", and was basically (from what I could understand) was the "free with service" model over there at the time. We enjoy wasting out money on figures that make us feel special. Honesly, overclocking aside, if I removed your 3Ghz p4 or 3200+ and replaced it with a p4 2ghz, or a 2200+, unless you benchmarked or noted the post, most people wouldn't even know. But what's the price difference on those cpus?? Enthusiast in the computer world are the people that are drawn into the hype, and are addicted to having the best, and have the money to waste on this hopelessness. So you may get another 15 FPS at 1600x1200 for the extra $1000 you put into your system, on the latest game. Most of us spend the majority of our time on the net, and let's face it, looking at porn, and reading posts and emails. I could do this perfectly, and I mean less than maybe 2 seconds difference on an old p2 333 I had w/xp pro than any of my new comps (p4 ati aiw 9800pro, 2500+ is the other), again, games aside of course. We're all geeks lined up at the feeding trough, and they're shoveling it down our throats with a big fat "$" grim on their mouths. So my answer in short, just buy it, whatever it is, when you need it, because 2months dwon the road you'll want something else anyway.

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Great post, this is the crap im talking abuot. Ya my system now has lasted my 2 years and I think thats pretty good(XP2500). But now that its time to upgrade, it's almost impossible to tell what is futureproof anymore. When I buy a new mobo and cpu, I want it to last, not end up throwing down another huge wad of cash to upgrade again.

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why is it time to upgrade? Pick another hobby if you don't want to spend money on computers.

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Theres a difference between spending money and wasting money.

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'Future Proof'. The ultimate oxymoron. :-)

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Intel are draaaaaaging and it is THEIR fault 64 bit Windows o/s is not out yet. If you don't believe me... read this, and also the other articles I list here.... http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,97863,00.asp (So even DELL are FED up with Intel and it's screwy technology) http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,3973,1561875,00.asp?kc=ETRSS02129TX1K0000532 (so Intel are so far behind they are having to wait for AMD to release a cpu before they can get to work on reverse engineering and and making their own!?) But of course, there are these newer articles trickling out, like this one, only 4 or 5 days old..... http://news.com.com/Intel+unveils+its+32&%2347%3B64-bit+chips/2100-1006_3-5250387.html Seems Intel may eventually get their butts in gear, but I am sticking with AMD.

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Yes, of course A 64BIT PROC WILL ALWAYS BE BETTER THAN A 32BIT OF THE SAME QUALITY. Of course the 64 is better right now, but it still lacks a lot of driver and software support to utilize it's full potential. Bottom line dont buy it know unless you think that 50more fps in unreal tournament is worth paying $500+ for. Secondly, intel in an attempt to keep up w/ amd's 64 bit gamble have put out their server proc and labeled it as a P4 HT Extreme Edition w/ 2mbL3 cache, but it is generally unavailable right now, it just looks good for the benchmarks. imo youre current system is more than adaquate for current games and apps so stick w/ what you have for now and be happy w/ it! ^(',')]}~~~:]>

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AMD are by far the best all intel do is come up with huge clocks but AMD think about what they do instead of jacking up the clock frequency , also your better of future proofing your self with the 64 bit and AMD are better for gaming hmmmm....doughnuts

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"also your better of future proofing your self with the 64 bit" not neccesarily, if intel just keeps beefing up their procs but stay 32bit while AMD is going 64 then software writers are going to continue writing for 32bit procs. Do you think the business world would ever switch over to AMD. Although im not saying that intel wont develop 64 bit procs, in fact it is highly likely that they will, we dont know what their plans are. We willjust have to wait and see what happens. ^(-.-)~~~]>:}>

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